From: TURTLE To: SAURON Subject: Hard Drives Date & Time: 04/29/90 20:50:48 Message Number 4051 A 40ms hard drive is fine for a BBS that probably isn't going to be transmitting stuff at more than 2400 baud to begin with, but I suspect for anything else it would become rather annoying rather quickly-- particularly since AmigaDOS never was noted for its speed even in the best of circumstances. I'd say if the trade-up to a faster hard drive were available for the small price Tyler was talking about, it'd probably be worth the investment. Of course, I also have an inherent distrust of hard drives from the start... --A floppy Turtle =========== From: TURTLE To: SCOTT E Subject: Pee Wee Date & Time: 04/29/90 20:55:11 Message Number 4052 People don't deserve respect for the amount of money they make; people deserve respect because they earn it. Pee Wee's income doesn't impress me any more than his infantile humor or his amazing lack of acting ability. =========== From: TURTLE To: JONBOY Subject: Z stuff Date & Time: 04/29/90 20:59:44 Message Number 4053 Ghi! My sympathies; turnkey menu software is bad enough on a micro, but on something like a Vax it's obscene. =========== From: TURTLE To: JONBOY Subject: Hacker stuff Date & Time: 04/29/90 21:02:33 Message Number 4054 >Assembly is only efficient if you stay away from macros and if you >program anything of serious size you /will/ use macros... Not me! I do everything in straight assembly, no macros, nuttin'. I write two thousand line routines without macros...'course I do have to maintain my reputation as a masochist, so maybe that's it. --A self-abusive Turtle I do, in fact, have 6ms floppies. Trouble is, I have a really good CP/M C compiler that was written with a Cromemco machine under C-DOS, using some funky double-sided format that none of my alien disk format utilities can recognize (it claims to be standard C-DOS DSDD but it ain't, so I can't get to it...and I don't even have access to the Cromemco machine that wrote the floppies in the first place). Such is life, mine at least. =========== From: ANGEL To: WHOMEVER Subject: Hi Date & Time: 04/29/90 23:35:39 Message Number 4055 Just a message to say "Hello" to everyone. I haven't signed on in awhile and am behind in the gossip. If anyone has any really good dirt, post it. =========== From: SCOTT E To: TURTLE Subject: money Date & Time: 04/30/90 06:51:30 Message Number 4056 well unfortunately I am money hungry, and If someone makes a lot of money doing something legal then I respect them. I do not care if they earn it or not. If I could be given a million dollars for no reason I wouldn't feel any worse then if I had earned it. That is just the way I am. A little greedy I guess., but oh well. see yaaaa =========== From: SCOTT E To: KEN OBER Subject: puked invaders Date & Time: 04/30/90 06:57:01 Message Number 4057 I gotta tell ya Ken. This movie was kinda dumb. It kinda reminded me of the evre popular Meatballs 2. You mean you didn't see that. too bad. Well the movie wasn't too bad, most Disney movies are okay. I think they should spend their money a little wiser though on movie ideas. You know maybe like SNOW WHITE DOES THE SEVEN DWARFS, OR MAYBE ALICE'S DEEP THROAT. But hey those are just my ideas. All kidding aside, it's not quite TMNT but it holds your interest and you'll even laugh a few times especially with the quiptic quotes they seem to come up with. seeee yaaaaaa!!!!!!!!! =========== From: CHIP P. UNICORN To: DONTHEN Subject: ROAD RALLY Date & Time: 04/30/90 07:08:58 Message Number 4058 >If radar detectors were illegal, do you think you could walk in to >K-mart or Radio Shack and pick one up? In a word, yes. Although radar detectors (I believe) are technically illegal, as far as I know, there is no punishment for owning one. As I said, there was a compromize in Congress: to raise the speed limit to 65, radar detectors had to go. Chip P. Unicorn =========== From: CHIP P. UNICORN To: KEN OBER Subject: God... Date & Time: 04/30/90 07:11:54 Message Number 4059 >All our laws are /not/ really laws at all... What laws are you thinking of? The "classical" laws of Physics have been known to be falso for over a hundred years. They're just really good approximations. Quantum physics says that any "laws" one comes up with -- no matter how accurate -- can ONLY be good approximations. The physical laws never were laws. Ever. Going back to metaphysics, God, and all, yeah -- our conception of God is very much based on Roman ideas. If Star Trek stole from Roman mythology, they might have also stolen from Judeo-Christian ideas. Chip P. Unicorn =========== From: CHIP P. UNICORN To: THRUD Subject: Am I here? Date & Time: 04/30/90 07:15:34 Message Number 4060 (Taking a look at the time of your message.) Methinks thou didst behold the Crack of Dawn. Melikes young hobbits. They makes wonderful breakfastses. Chip P. Unicorn =========== From: CHIP P. UNICORN To: TURTLE Subject: Missiles Date & Time: 04/30/90 07:21:42 Message Number 4062 >I'd prefer to spend it on something that doesn't go "Ffffffft!" Ya mean a VAX doesn't hum? Now, come on, Turtle -- you don't think a small Stinger missile might not slow down the Airport problem for a short while? At least it would make the pilots REAL nervous. Chip P. Unicorn =========== From: CHIP P. UNICORN To: TURTLE Subject: Religion... Date & Time: 04/30/90 07:24:25 Message Number 4063 >It doesn't make any sense to talk about the time before the universe >because in a very real sense time did not exist before the universe >did. Right. Time requires matter to exist. Without matter, no time. Singularities (like the matter before the Big One) aren't really matter. Okay. Gotcha. Love fragments. Good device. Grunts. Use 'em later. Chip P. Unicorn =========== From: CHIP P. UNICORN To: SNAKEBYTE Subject: -=*><*=- Date & Time: 04/30/90 07:27:18 Message Number 4064 >And what about the theory that the planets are just atomic particles >in a very very very large other system. Uhhh..... right. There are similarities between atomic particles and electrons (they both revolve around something in the center), but there are HUGE differences: 1. Electrons are "fuzzy" in the sense that they don't really exist in any one place. They're more wave than particle. (Look up De Broglie (sp?) for more info.) Planets, so far as I can tell, are solid -- and not spread out. 2. Planets seem to keep to the rule: one planet, one orbit. In the first orbit, atoms have two orbits, then they have six orbits, then ten. (Unless they're excited -- which I'm not getting into.) 3. An atom is unstable when it has more electrons than protons. (Generally.) This solar system has nine (or more) planets; one "proton" (of a sun.) In a miniaturized world, this would be H-9 -- a REAL bitch of an element to find. (One person, a Wally B. Whatnot, once claimed to have found it. He also claimed to know Bigfoot personally, and called UFO people "some of his best friends.) On the other hoof, it's real likely that any chemical laws of that "superuniverse" above us are completely different than any laws down here -- so all of my arguments might flop completely. But, I hope not. Chip P. Unicorn =========== From: CHIP P. UNICORN To: CORWYN OF AMBER Subject: Godtalk Date & Time: 04/30/90 07:38:15 Message Number 4065 Shoot everyone who disagrees with you? Chip P. Unicorn =========== From: CHIP P. UNICORN To: ACAPULCO Subject: Pee Wee Date & Time: 04/30/90 07:38:46 Message Number 4066 >If I said Ted Bundy was from Sarasota, would you automatically offer >him respect? Yup. =========== From: CHIP P. UNICORN To: DELPHI Subject: Godtalk Date & Time: 04/30/90 07:51:00 Message Number 4067 Dear Delphi, Okay. I'm understanding you, now. Here are my beliefs, agreements, and disagreements. I believe that although spirit is tied to matter, it is separatable from matter. A dead person -- so far as I can tell -- has no spirit remaining to animate him. Again, I believe in the separation of the Godhood from the universe itself. If I read you correctly, do you deify existance? That is, is the sum total of life the god that there is? Whether or not other planes exist -- to me seems an insolvable problem, given the technology we have now. I can't prove they exist; I can't prove they don't exist. I will believe in them when I have some sort of proof: either a creature from another plane stops here and does something which is inexplicable otherwise -- or, one of us visits another plane -- or, the need for alternate planes of reality is shown by a physicist to explain phenomina. I can see no conceivable way to prove they don't exist -- but I don't consider that sufficient to believ in them. As I've mentioned innumerable times before, I'm a born-again Christian -- and a little conservative in terms of my definition of Deity. But, I seek out people who disagree with me -- to help me define myself and my God further. (Yup! Disagree. When someone agrees with you, they're not likely to search very deeply within your logic for errors.) It sounds as if you're a very intelligent person, and I'd love to contnue discussing philosohy and religion with you. Chip P. Unicorn =========== From: CHIP P. UNICORN To: ANGEL Subject: Hi Date & Time: 04/30/90 08:03:59 Message Number 4068 >If anyone has any really good dirt, post it. Well, horse apples aren't usually welcome on any system... \/ / Chip P. Unicorn oo =========== From: KEN OBER To: ALL Subject: Good News! Date & Time: 04/30/90 12:43:16 Message Number 4069 I have sold my 128D for $300! Cowabunga, dudes! This be really awesome I guess I have enough money for my Hard Drive now, so look forward to the new BBS pretty soon! -Ken Ober- =========== From: BEATLE To: TURTLE Subject: Pee Wee Date & Time: 04/30/90 16:12:57 Message Number 4071 I know, it was stupid. It was REAL stupid, but some stupidity is quite amusing sometimes... About walking out, I didn't walk out on anything ever, but I do remember a man walking out on "Great Balls of Fire" (I don't blame him) and he left too late. The movie ended two minutes later ... He mumbled something like "This was shit, I want my money back". =========== From: BEATLE To: SCOTT E Subject: Pee Wee Date & Time: 04/30/90 16:16:39 Message Number 4072 I think I found "Police Academy 6" the worst movie of the decade. I might sit through another PA film, but not a single one of 'em twice.  That's saying something, too, because I can stand just about anything. I actually enjoyed watching "Private School" and "Howard the Duck". =========== From: BEATLE To: CHIP P. UNICORN Subject: Religion... Date & Time: 04/30/90 16:22:45 Message Number 4073 > This is usually not a good assumption... I agree. =========== From: BEATLE To: KEN OBER Subject: God... Date & Time: 04/30/90 16:24:03 Message Number 4074 > So Go is like that Giant Roman dude in that one Star Trek episode... I hope you realize how inane that statement is. Well, I guess it might not be stupid, but it sounds odd. If you really want to make your point, say something serious. For instance, someone today told me about a film that shows the fetus trying to avoid an abortion. It sounds scary enough to convert a pro-choicer to a pro-lifer ... (I didn't see the film though) =========== From: BEATLE To: DONTHEN Subject: article Date & Time: 04/30/90 16:34:30 Message Number 4075 Never thought of that (why, I wonder)... Out of 13 types my friend and I created, only three are about local furries (one on Bart, one on Turtle, and one on Tyler's lounge lizard)... the others go something like these: Rodenta Chipndalus (biped talking chipmunks) Felinus Tomus (silent cats) Felinus Sylvesterus (talking cats) Felinus Emceeskatus (rapping cats) There, I figure everyone would get those! (By the way, I assume that other people in other states know what Rufuses are since there was one in Mythagoras)... =========== From: BEATLE To: SNAKEBYTE Subject: Movies???? Date & Time: 04/30/90 16:41:16 Message Number 4076 Why be ashamed? TMNT actually was a good movie. Not the best of the year by far, no heavy symbolism or drama, but it was entertaining. I also got the feeling that the appeal to older filmgoers is that this film isn't taking itself seriously, even though the kids do... SPACED INVADERS? Well, I REALLY want to see it. If it has funny jokes, good, but if it falls flat, send it back to Mars. =========== From: BEATLE To: SCOTT E Subject: call the doctor Date & Time: 04/30/90 16:44:18 Message Number 4077 First of all, don't trust that review! The idiot has the film confused with the add campaign. If you watch the commercial carefully, it isn't Spring Break, it's Halloween! I myself wouldn't feel ashamed walking into any movie. I would go see a cartoon or an R rated film with the same state of mind. Or should I rephrase: a G or R rated film. I intend to see "Fantasia" when it is re-released. Any animation people out there want to make a party or something out of it? I know a lot of us are into animation. =========== From: KEN OBER To: ALL Subject: * HA! * Date & Time: 04/30/90 17:04:36 Message Number 4078 FROM THE JUNE ISSUE OF AMIGA WORLD MAGAZINE: Specs on the /very/ recently released Amiga 300 computer.... o 68030/882 @ 25 MHz o Amiga Enhanced Chip Set (ECS) o 1 meg Chip RAM expandable to 2 megs on board o 1 meg Fast RAM expandable to: 4 Megs on motherboard w/ 256 * 4 DRAMS 16 Megs on motherboard w/ 1K * 4 DRAMS o Built-In Display Enhancer (eliminates interlace flicker) o Internal SCSI Hard Drive (40 Megs Std. -- 100 Megs Opt.) o Internal Real-Time Clock w/ RAM o 4 New Zorro III Expansion Slots (Downward Compat. w/ A2000) o 1 CPU expansion connector (200-Pin w/ processor-takeover capability) o External expansion connectors 23-pin Amiga video (15.75 KHz typical) 15-pin VGA-style video (31.5 KHz typical) External SCSI connector o 32-Bit access to on-board ROM o 32-bit CPU access to chip RAM o 32-bit fast-RAM support Custom Controller supporting static-column mode DRAMs and allowing CPU burst access to RAM o 32-bit DMA-based on-board SCSI controller o Low-profile case supporting total of three 3.5" drives o Front-mounted power switch o Easier disk-drive installation and removal o Hardware and software support for 60Hz video on European machines The computer is packaged with AmigaDOS 2.0 (With a "NeXT Look") 1.7 Gigabytes of RAM total 1280 x 400 maximum resolution PRICES: Amiga 3000 (25MHz/40 MB) -- $3999 Amiga 3000 (25MHz/100 MB) -- $4499 Amiga 3000 (16MHz/40 MB) -- $3299 A1950 Monitor (For New Graphics Modes) -- $799 A2060 ARCNET Card -- $229 A2065 Ethernet Card -- $349 A 40 Mhz version of the A3000 is on the way to compete with the new 486 IBM's and MAC II FX's... It also has a TURBO IBM XT card availible -- No word on UNIX, tho... -Ken Ober- =========== From: CRYSTAL To: ANGEL Subject: Hi Date & Time: 04/30/90 17:45:00 Message Number 4079 Hello Angel, It is nice to have you back. I guess the only real gossip has to do with computers, and we all know I know nothing about that. But hello anyway. * CRYSTAL * =========== From: CRYSTAL To: CHIP P. UNICORN Subject: Radar Detectors Date & Time: 04/30/90 17:48:44 Message Number 4080 Chip, you need to get a radar detector. * CRYSTAL * =========== From: CORWYN OF AMBER To: ALL Subject: The Shadow Date & Time: 04/30/90 18:09:22 Message Number 4081 The Shadow's back up folks, 23hrs a day (Don't call between four and five am, that's Fidonet Mail Hour) (813) 359-1717 I'll be getting whatever interesting echo's I can find, but call now, and get some discussions going! =========== From: DELPHI To: CHIP P. UNICORN Subject: godtalk Date & Time: 04/30/90 18:20:40 Message Number 4082 As far as denominational affiliation, I'm a Unitarian Universalist, which means we honor the basic worth and dignity of everyone, but other than that we have no creed. We ask questions. We are seekers of the truth. Mostly, we seek diversity. That's why I found a philosophical/ spiritual home there -- there's no set dogma and questioning is encouraged. So, as for god/goddess, my feeling is that the god-consciousness is greater than the sum of the parts (all of existence), but not a separate entity or being. I believe we all (even Plato's chairs) have some of this god-essence in ourselves and perhaps that this essence is the spark that gives us both connectedness with the spiritual and independent free will. Other planes, which I prefer to call dimensions, aren't that relevant since we live in this one, although I do believe they exist. I never considered why because that didn't Maybe it's worth thinking about... What was next? Well, I suppose you'll remindr (problem keyboard) remind me. It's good to have dialog about things philosophical, altho I may be a bit radical for you depending on your view of Christianity. Have you ever read any work by Mary Daly? =========== From: CORWYN OF AMBER To: SNAKEBYTE Subject: -=*><*=- Date & Time: 04/30/90 19:55:05 Message Number 4084 Say hello to the nihilists?? - Corwyn =========== From: CORWYN OF AMBER To: TURTLE Subject: Hard Drives Date & Time: 04/30/90 19:59:18 Message Number 4085 Whether a 40ms drive will bother you depends upon a few things: 1. Whether you plan to run a defagg'r on the drive semi-regularly 2. What the data transfer rate is. I've got a Miniscribe 40Mbyte (when used w/ MFM) drive that's running on an Adaptec RLL controller.. The Average track to track seek is about 60ms, but the Data Transfer Rate is 10Mb/S (That's bits, not Bytes) If I don't run an Optimizer for a few weeks, I'll start to notice.. but now frontdoor does a maintenance event every day, and defrags both partitions.. if it's ms or Megs... go for Megs!! - Corwyn =========== From: CORWYN OF AMBER To: SCOTT E Subject: money Date & Time: 04/30/90 20:04:51 Message Number 4086 I respect people more if they make their money illegally w/o hurting anyone.. more challenge! - Corwyn =========== From: CORWYN OF AMBER To: CHIP P. UNICORN Subject: ROAD RALLY Date & Time: 04/30/90 20:05:57 Message Number 4087 You're wrong Chip!!! Some states (/Without/ consent from the FCC have made Radar Detectors illegal.. It is /not/ a federal law, and oversteps the State's jurisdiction. You /can/ listen to the radio all you want! - Corwyn P.S. All radar detectors sold in the US have been Certified By the FCC! =========== From: CORWYN OF AMBER To: CHIP P. UNICORN Subject: -=*><*=- Date & Time: 04/30/90 20:10:12 Message Number 4088 as to 2. Planets seem to keep to the rule: one planet, one orbit. Have you ever tried to observe a planet from a higher level of galactic magnitude.. moot point. =========== From: CORWYN OF AMBER To: CHIP P. UNICORN Subject: Godtalk Date & Time: 04/30/90 20:11:30 Message Number 4089 I was in a bad mood.. actually you could just shoodt Berggren and I'd be OK. - Corwyn =========== From: RICHARD To: KEN OBER Subject: TURTLE POWER! Date & Time: 04/30/90 20:48:20 Message Number 4090 I saw it, took my grandchildern, I enjoy it a lot more then I through I would..:) =========== From: RUFUS To: CHIP P. UNICORN Subject: ROAD RALLY Date & Time: 04/30/90 21:09:18 Message Number 4093 >NO amount of stealth material, radar jammers...can stop that... Yea, but a missle would do the job. =========== From: RUFUS To: RAVEN Subject: Gee..... Date & Time: 04/30/90 21:16:35 Message Number 4094 I'd be more concerned about the strength of the apartment. Those mainframes are just a wee bit heavy. =========== From: RUFUS To: TURTLE Subject: Anarchy Now Date & Time: 04/30/90 21:19:29 Message Number 4095 >...who used to take an E-tool to Ft. Lauderdale Beach with him and dig >tank traps... What's an E-tool? =========== From: RUFUS To: ANGEL Subject: Hi Date & Time: 04/30/90 21:46:12 Message Number 4096 Welcome back to the wonderful (?) world of BBS land. I have some really good dirt, but it's in the front yard. Posting it would be the death blow to our sickly grass. ...anyone wanna help me seal all the sprinkler systems around town? =========== From: RUFUS To: BEATLE Subject: article Date & Time: 04/30/90 21:55:06 Message Number 4097 >Felinus Tomus (silent cats) I /think/ Tom may have talked in a few of the cartoons (someone wanna confirm this?) >know what Rufuses are... Errr, like there's only one Rufus. Rufus is just your standard human with a few modifications (the tail and the arm, along with some other 'small' features). Rufus' offspring would be normal, since the tail was grafted on. It was not a result of genetic modification (not on the part of Rufus anyways). ...I'm going to bed, my English skills are breaking down again. =========== From: RUFUS To: ALL Subject: Road Rally Date & Time: 04/30/90 22:10:01 Message Number 4098 So, what are the final plans for the Road Rally? Information like when it starts, where it starts, and the approx. time to complete the course would be real useful. If anyone wants to tag along with Zot Gnop and me your welcome to. ...shotgun! =========== From: TURTLE To: CHIP P. UNICORN Subject: ROAD RALLY Date & Time: 04/30/90 23:32:00 Message Number 4101 A definite statement: Radar detectors are not illegal nationwide. No way, no how. A couple of states outlawed them when those states raised their speed limits, and in those states you cannot purchase radar detectors. In most states, including Florida, posession, sale, and use of radar detectors is neither prohibited nor controlled. Sorry, but to whomever told you Congress made 'em illegal: It just ain't so. How do I know? Simple. I asked a cop who pulled through drive-through. --A practical Turtle =========== From: TURTLE To: BEATLE Subject: Not Pee Wee Date & Time: 04/30/90 23:36:57 Message Number 4102 >It [Pee-Wee's Big Adventure] was REAL stupid, but some stupidity is >quite amusing sometimes... I agree wholeheartedly. Trouble is, Pee-Wee doesn't qualify. "Maximum Overdrive," for example, was a wonderfully stupid movie that I laughed wholeheartedly at--at least until I realized that it wasn't intended as a parody of horror movies. On the other hand, there's only so much of Pee-Wee Herman's juvenile humor I can take without losing my lunch. --An unamused Turtle =========== From: TURTLE To: BEATLE Subject: Fantasia Date & Time: 04/30/90 23:42:12 Message Number 4103 I am planning to see Fantasia...oh, about six or seven hundred times when it's re-released. I bet Fox, Wratt, Donthen, and in fact most of the local furry crowd probably feels the same way, so it sounds like a potential centerpiece for a furry party or two. --A furry Turtle =========== From: TURTLE To: KEN OBER Subject: * HA! * Date & Time: 04/30/90 23:44:23 Message Number 4104 According to a Unix hacker in my Compilers class, the Amiga 3000 is supposed to ship with Unix System V+ (Bell Labs Unix 5.4) as well as AmigaDOS 2.0. It's also supposed to ship with yacc, uucp, Open Look, XWindows, and a few other goodies, at least according to one magazine article I've seen. What was your source of information, and did it mention the Unix side of the A3000 at all? (At one point I even heard rumours that AmigaDOS 2.0 was going to run as a satellite task under Unix on the A3000, but that's probably apocrypha.) If the thing /does/ ship with Unix, it'd almost be sufficient to make me choose the 40MHz version of the 3000 over, say, a DECstation 2100 or Sun SPARCstation I if I'm ever in the market for a Unix workstation... --An Amigaphile Turtle =========== From: TURTLE To: CORWYN OF AMBER Subject: FIDO stuff Date & Time: 04/30/90 23:50:58 Message Number 4105 Do you have a FIDO node number yet? Who's the official net host for this area now? Who, if anyone, is responsible for the local echo feeds? Are you sure you want to do that? What is the meaning of life? Is the Amiga version of Binkley as obscenely large as the IBM version and as bad as the Atari ST version? Does anybody care? =========== From: TURTLE To: RUFUS Subject: Anarchy Now Date & Time: 04/30/90 23:59:38 Message Number 4106 An E-Tool is a U.S. Army Entrenching Tool. It's a really neat fold-up shovel that is impressively well-designed, and really effective too. =========== From: CHIP P. UNICORN To: TURTLE Subject: John Cage Date & Time: 05/01/90 08:10:14 Message Number 4107 Turtle- Too bad you missed the concert last Friday night. They performed a Cage piece which almost compared to a Turtle spew. Bicycles, salad, anarchistic slogans, exercise, and feedback loops. All at once! (Not to mention religion, shoving people out of their seats, and men in long, white coats.) Beatuiful music! Chip P. Unicorn =========== From: CHIP P. UNICORN To: BEATLE Subject: Pee Wee Date & Time: 05/01/90 08:13:49 Message Number 4108 Personally, I found "Police Academy 6" to be a stirring film that filled one's heart with joy, and plumbing the depths of worlds of pathos. I was truly shocked and surprised when it did not win Oscars in every category. In fact... You're not buying this BS, are you? Chip P. Unicorn =========== From: CHIP P. UNICORN To: BEATLE Subject: God... Date & Time: 05/01/90 08:17:34 Message Number 4109 >Someone told me today about a film that shows the fetus trying to >avoid an abortion. I've heard about that film, myself -- every year at my Christian high school, some of the teachers tried to get it shown at one of our chapels. It was usually turned down by the administration. Face it: abortions are NOT pretty. Even the hardest pro-choicer will admit (with a little prodding) that you're killing life, and that you're killing life that could become human when you abort a fetus. As I said before, I oppose BOTH the pro-life and the pro-choice groups: neither tries to solve the underlying problem: How can we keep abortions from being necessary? Chip P. Unicorn =========== From: CHIP P. UNICORN To: BEATLE Subject: call the doctor Date & Time: 05/01/90 08:23:01 Message Number 4110 Beatle, When Fantasia is re-released, wild humans couldn't stop me from seeing it. Chip P. Unicorn =========== From: CHIP P. UNICORN To: CRYSTAL Subject: Radar Detectors Date & Time: 05/01/90 08:24:17 Message Number 4111 My beautiful Crystal- Perhaps. But, think about the Green Thing. Can it actually break the sped limit? Chip P. Unicorn =========== From: CHIP P. UNICORN To: DELPHI Subject: godtalk Date & Time: 05/01/90 08:27:05 Message Number 4112 Dear Delphi, Please: don't worry about being radical. Several close friends are Wiccan, and one of my closest is a Caballist. To be a seeker of the Truth is a worthwhile occupation, indeed. However, it's really difficult to know the Truth about God. As one athiest said (I'm not sure whom): the finite cannot pierce the infinite. In other words, our mortal minds could not conceive of the complexity of God -- whether that God be the whole of existence, or that God be the "outside of the universe but interacting" one that I espouse. Now that we seem to be communicating, we can begin to create our own language to make things a bit easier. From now on, I'll refer to "Adonai" (though I'm not Jewish) when I refer to the Christian concept of a God outside of space who interacts with the universe. (To make things really simple.) Could you do the same for the concept of the whole of creation as a deity? (Something similar to "Nature" or "Cosmos," perhaps?) It's really unfortunate that "dogma" has such negative connotations. I've learned in mathematics that without assumptions, nothing (well -- very little) can be proven. (From no assumptions, you can prove either Adonai exists or He does not. But not which one.) To me, dogma are merely the common grounds among a religious group: they shouldn't be thought of as boulders, and the completed works of God, but as stepping stones or building blocks to a fuller understanding of God. With no foundation, the house sinks: no meaningful questions can be asked when people don't share similar beliefs. Only when there's a common, stable base can the building be erected: only when there's a common, stable base can there be a church. I'm curious: if it's the "spark" of the universe that gives us free will, why was it distributed so much more to certain entities (humanity, dogs, banana plants) than others (rocks, earth, moondust)? What, in these forms attracted the life force so strongly -- or what repelled =========== From: CHIP P. UNICORN To: DELPHI Subject: godtalk Date & Time: 05/01/90 08:46:43 Message Number 4113 this life force so strongly from other entities? I don't see the signs of life within rocks as I do within people. Are other dimensions worth thinking about? Like I said, until there's been some contact (either way) between dimensions, I won't worry about it. It doesn't matter. I've never read anything by Mary Daly. What views do she espouse? Have you read anything by C. S. Lewis? (Be REAL careful of his assumptions, however...) Another person (who is NOT a Christian) you might enjoy is Raymond Smullyan: our conversation might turn something similar to several of his ideas... Chip P. Unicorn =========== From: CHIP P. UNICORN To: CORWYN OF AMBER Subject: money Date & Time: 05/01/90 08:58:27 Message Number 4114 The easiest way to do that is to have a brothel -- and test the guys and girls for AIDS (and all other diseases) weekly. Not much of a challenge. Chip P. Unicorn =========== From: CHIP P. UNICORN To: RUFUS Subject: Hi Date & Time: 05/01/90 09:04:57 Message Number 4116 >...anyone wanna help me seal all the sprinkler systems around town? Seal them? I have two pictures arising from that idea: 1. "Wilbur... Wilbur..." Her voice was tinged with fear. "Yes, Mildred?" "Wilbur, look outside the window..." Wilbur shot a glance outside the window. "Why, Midred. There are circus animals out there." "I don't care what they are. Just get RID of them." When Wilbur left the garage with his shovel, he saw that every one of the seals had been taped to a sprinkler head. 2. "Wilbur... Wilbur!" He tossed his head and mumbled, "Yes, Miss Vavavoom. I'd love to play Nymph and Satyr with you." "Wilbur... wake up!" "Huh? What's wrong?" "I just heard a high pitched noise, an explosion, and then it rained for a few seconds. Go outside and look." Tossing his head to wake himself, Wilbur tossed on a terry cloth bathrobe, walked down the stairs, and looked outside. Every one of his sprinkler heads had been shattered. =========== From: CHIP P. UNICORN To: RUFUS Subject: article Date & Time: 05/01/90 09:13:22 Message Number 4117 Several of the Tom and Jerry cartoons had talking in them, but I don't think Tom ever talked more than the sound of a muted trumpet in the background music. (Remember Jerry's cousin who sang such wonderful songs as: "I was riding down the trail to Santa Fe, And I met a pretty gal along the way, I said, 'Ain't we met before,' And she drew her fourty-four, So I tipped my hat and slowly rode away. I was riding down the trail to Santa Fe, And I met another gal along the way, I said, 'Baby, you're a dream,' She said, 'Touch me and I scream,' So I tipped my hat and slowly rode away." Chip P. Unicorn =========== From: KEN OBER To: TURTLE Subject: * HA! * Date & Time: 05/01/90 12:53:02 Message Number 4120 I got my information from AMIGA WORLD MAGAZINE -- They have aquired an A3000 from Commodore-Amiga, Inc. The mentioned /nothing/ about the UNIX -- Maybe that will come with the 40 Mhz 68040 version in a few weeks.... =========== From: SCOTT E To: TURTLE Subject: downloading Date & Time: 05/01/90 16:50:59 Message Number 4121 turtle, help me please. I can't seem to download a file from this bbs. I obviously am doing something wrong. Please help. I am using procomm as my comm. software and am trying to download file 15 bullet14.txt. thanks. =========== From: SCOTT E To: CRYSTAL Subject: you sexxy thing Date & Time: 05/01/90 16:55:18 Message Number 4122 Hi crytal. It's tues. and I hope your week is going all right. Mine is much better then last week. Feeling better I hope. :) have a great rest of the week and hang in there. I bet the old farts get pretty cranky at a drug store huh. What aisle are the enimas. are they next to the \ suppositories and the ex-lax. Boy mix those together and we could have a major blow out in sarasota. Seeeeee yaaaaaa =========== From: SCOTT E To: ALL Subject: road rally Date & Time: 05/01/90 16:58:27 Message Number 4123 I would love to come to this road rally as long as it is not the opening day of my favorite movie of all time disney Fantasia. I personally would like to have crystal in my car and 2 other women would be nice. But I won't hog all the woman. So just one is alright. So when and where is this road rally of ours. Hope soon!!! =========== From: SCOTT E To: ALL Subject: movies Date & Time: 05/01/90 17:01:03 Message Number 4124 Saw pretty woman last night. It was the best movie I have seen all year. Julia Roberts is hot looking. Never realized that before. Rich Gere is great in the role he plays. In case someone hasn't heard this is the basic storyline. Richard Gere is a rich businessman just like Don Trump (though I read the other day he isn't as rich as he was). Well rich is in LA on business and takes his lawyers E'SPIRIT FOR A CRUISE DOWN HOLLYWOOD BLVD. IN comes Julia miss prostitute 1990. Well to make a long story short rich hires her to be his bosom buddy for a week in exchange for 3000 dollars. In short as you guess they fall in love and as in almost all disney(touchstone) films they live happily ever after. It's kinda a modern day cinderella story. Will go and see it a few more times. I reeeeeaaaallllllly enjoyed it as you can tell. Have a good week.; ;) =========== From: CORWYN OF AMBER To: TURTLE Subject: FIDO stuff Date & Time: 05/01/90 18:50:26 Message Number 4125 No, I don't have my Fido Node Number, and I'M NOT HAPPY ABOUT IT!!! George Emigh (Above Board) is the local host, he seems to be very good about most stuff, but he's taking forever to get my node # to me! Richard Whidden (No Name BBS) apparently does the feeds for most of the echo's, but I haven't talked to him about getting any because... I STILL DON'T HAVE MY NODE NUMBER!!! (sorry 'bout that,I'm kinda upset) I don't run Binkley.. I use Frontdoor (1.99c) which is slightly /bigger/ than Bink, the difference is that you don't need any extra programs to proccess your nodelist or set up your mail packets for you. I don't actually know that much about Bink, never tried it.. Frank Merrill told me he'd used both and Frontdoor was more efficient in the long run. - Corwyn =========== From: CORWYN OF AMBER To: CHIP P. UNICORN Subject: money Date & Time: 05/01/90 19:08:25 Message Number 4126 Try it.. then tell me it's not a challenge, whatever you might think, running a brothel's not easy (Although not speaking from personal experience.. have you ever read 'The night for pay' can't remember the name of the guy that wrote it though.. it's an autobiography of a "pimp" actually he came across as pretty honest, but a little slimy. - Corwyn =========== From: YNGLING To: KEN OBER Subject: Good News! Date & Time: 05/01/90 19:35:02 Message Number 4127 Ken, If I took up a collection, how much would I have to get to pay you to /stop/ using the phrase "cowabunga, dudes?" Do you even know what cowabunga means (aside from aparently appearing more than once in the Teenage Mutant Ninja Turtles from Hell movie)? The Yngling =========== From: C.C.A. To: CHIP P. UNICORN Subject: More God... Date & Time: 05/01/90 20:22:07 Message Number 4128 Good Job!!!!!!! =========== From: RUFUS To: TURTLE Subject: Fantasia Date & Time: 05/01/90 21:12:23 Message Number 4130 Of course, the fun part will be attempting to sneak in a video camera to tape the movie. So, when will it be re-released? =========== From: RUFUS To: TURTLE Subject: Anarchy Now Date & Time: 05/01/90 21:14:51 Message Number 4131 Ahhh, mucho thanks. I think I've seen them before at some place or another (my memory is going tonight). =========== From: RUFUS To: CHIP P. UNICORN Subject: Hi Date & Time: 05/01/90 21:18:55 Message Number 4132 I was thinking more along the line of RTV Silicone Rubber (GE, we bring good things to life then we stick 'em together) or epoxy. =========== From: TURTLE To: SCOTT E Subject: downloading Date & Time: 05/01/90 23:17:52 Message Number 4134 Several people have had problems downloading with Procomm, primarily because Procomm's XModem file transfer routine isn't worth a revolting box of bug parts. You have to tell Procomm to use XModem Checksum (I'm not sure how to do that; you might want to try one of the more IBM types floating around, if you can find one); there's some manual toggle between XModem CRC and XModem Checksum somewhere. (XModem CRC will /not/ work.) Alternately, you might try getting a better terminal program somewhere; Corwyn of Amber has a couple of good public domain programs, as does Chip P. Unicorn. --A helpful Turtle =========== From: TURTLE To: CORWYN OF AMBER Subject: FIDO stuff Date & Time: 05/01/90 23:21:58 Message Number 4135 You might try getting your node number from Steve Hall; he seems fairly efficient about those things. Technically, the net host for this area is still Alfie Bruhel (American United Broadcasting), but he's in the process of being evicted forcibly from that position since he never maintains his system and rarely bothers even to notice when it goes down for weeks at a time. Anyway, Alfie went to Germany recently, and to make a long and nasty story short and nasty, everyone staged a revolt in his absence and started re-routing all the echo traffic through Minas Tirith and the No-Name (with the result that there are now two completely unrelated Suncoast Gossip echoes that don't speak to each other), and George is the kinda-sorta de-facto acting net host. What with all the politicking and stuff going on, it's somehow not surprising George has forgotten about you. Another place you might want to try to get a node number, if you really get impatient, is from Arlene Oakes at the Grand BBS; at the very least, she'll probably be able to get George Emigh to get moving. Happy hunting. --A Matrix-free Turtle =========== From: SNAKEBYTE To: SCOTT E Subject: call the doctor Date & Time: 05/02/90 00:57:11 Message Number 4136 I agree in part. I DO enjoy going to those movies (really, ANY movies), but I don't necessarily drag my kids along for that reason. Most of the time I try not to because it can be rather distracting having ruggies pullin' you around durin' the important parts of the flick. I like to see my kids have fun at a movie, and I already know all the words to AN AMERICAN TAIL, LADY AND THE TRAMP, DUMBO, WINNIE THE POOH, NEVER ENDING STORY, THE DARK CRYSTAL, HONEY I SHRUNK THE KIDS, BATMAN, SLEEPING BEAUTY and a ton of others I am bombarded with daily....yeah, I laugh at the movies!!!! =========== From: SNAKEBYTE To: KEN OBER Subject: TURTLE POWER! Date & Time: 05/02/90 01:02:10 Message Number 4137 Cowabunga, dude. =========== From: SNAKEBYTE To: CHIP P. UNICORN Subject: -=*><*=- Date & Time: 05/02/90 01:03:58 Message Number 4138 Shit, I'll have to digest your response as I attempt to shake this three dimensional shadow off my four dimensional limbs....I hate it when that happens!!! =========== From: SNAKEBYTE To: BEATLE Subject: Howard Date & Time: 05/02/90 01:06:13 Message Number 4139 "I have no license....and my name's NOT Jack"zzzzzzzzzzzzzzzzap loved it!!! =========== From: SNAKEBYTE To: BEATLE Subject: Spaced Date & Time: 05/02/90 01:08:04 Message Number 4140 A little dry, but some parts were pretty good. The dude that looks and acts like Jack Nicholson was alright. Just remember..... "Prepare to die, Earth scum"......cute =========== From: SNAKEBYTE To: CORWYN OF AMBER Subject: -=*><*=- Date & Time: 05/02/90 01:12:03 Message Number 4141 Hi, pick me up some beer while you're out. -Snake =========== From: C.C.A. To: ANYONE Subject: Murphy's Kids Date & Time: 05/02/90 07:15:19 Message Number 4144 Mead's Law: Paper is always strongest at mthe perferation(sp.?) =========== From: CHIP P. UNICORN To: CORWYN OF AMBER Subject: money Date & Time: 05/02/90 08:43:20 Message Number 4145 No -- I've never read 'The Night for Pay.' But, heck -- making money illegally without hurting anyone still sounds much easier than making money legally without hurting anyone. =========== From: CHIP P. UNICORN To: C.C.A. Subject: More God... Date & Time: 05/02/90 08:46:03 Message Number 4146 Dear C.C.A., Hello! And thank for the compliment! I haven't seen your face around before... Tell me about yourself: who (and what) are you? What do you do? Have any hobbies? If you're new to this BBS, then welcome! If you're not new, but are just beginning to post, then welcome to our conversations! Chip P. Unicorn =========== From: CHIP P. UNICORN To: C.C.A. Subject: Murphy's Kids Date & Time: 05/02/90 08:54:26 Message Number 4147 Hofstadter's Law: Everything will take longer than you think, even when you take Hofstadter's law into account. Newcome's Law: Whenever it is written, the name 'Newcom' is always misspelled. O'Toole's commentary: Murphy was an optimist. =========== From: KEN OBER To: YNGLING Subject: Cowabunga, Dude Date & Time: 05/02/90 12:51:52 Message Number 4148 Actually, the phrase appeared only /once/ in the entire movie at the end..... Pay me enough for my Hard Drive and I'll stop .... :) =========== From: YNGLING To: SNAKEBYTE Subject: TURTLE POWER! Date & Time: 05/02/90 13:58:28 Message Number 4150 Snakebyte - I'll offer /you/ double what I'm offering Ken not to use that phrase in the future. I /know/ you're old enough to remember the origin of "cowabunga" so I wont even ask... The Yngling =========== From: YNGLING To: ALL Subject: J.Y.C. Date & Time: 05/02/90 14:05:35 Message Number 4151 For any who are interested, an exerpt from a letter from Jacques-Yves Cousteau: "When a dolphin mother gives birth, her baby is expelled underwater . The first act following birth is critical: to lift the freshly born youngster up to the surface for its first breath. So powerful is this motherly instinct that other struggling animals have been pushed to the surface instinctively by female dolphins. "Surely this blessed miracle of life is the greatest treasure on earth. Yet do we earthlings cherish and guard it? On the contrary. Each month month we now pour millions of tons of poisonous waste into the global water system. Many of our lakes, rivers, and coastal waters have received their mortal wound. The water is undrinkable. The fish and shellfish, if they exist at all, are contaminated. "Is all now lost? I do not believe it...I passionately believe that the perceptive few who have the opportunity to see the ultimate disaster ahead must band together now to warn the slumbering many. (Is it not always thus?) Such corrective measures as exist must be put into effect immediately. Pioneering research and exploration to help us better understand the sea and its creatures must be undertaken without delay. "To this new crusade I solemnly pledge what years remain to me." -Captain Jacques-Yves Cousteau The Cousteau Society 930 West 21st Street Norfolk, Virginia 23517 $15.00 annual membership fee $25.00 family membership fee [ALL donations gratefully accepted] =========== From: BEATLE To: CHIP P. UNICORN Subject: God... Date & Time: 05/02/90 17:56:18 Message Number 4153 > How can we keep abortions from being necessary? I like that philosophy. We need to get more people to work toward that. =========== From: BEATLE To: CHIP P. UNICORN Subject: article Date & Time: 05/02/90 17:59:18 Message Number 4154 Well, I heard somewhere (and I'm SURE of this) that Tom never spoke, but Jerry did. =========== From: BEATLE To: RUFUS Subject: Fantasia Date & Time: 05/02/90 18:01:50 Message Number 4155 Disney will re-release "Fantasia" in October to commemorate the 50th anniversary. It has apparently been moved back a couple months. It was originally to be out in the summer. re: video cameras. I wish we still had drive-ins. No audio problems. Also, in a theatre, you may be to close to the screen. Something like that happened to me at Disney MGM studios. I taped the film in the Great Movie Ride, and I had a horrible time getting the whole screen in. =========== From: CORWYN OF AMBER To: SNAKEBYTE Subject: -=*><*=- Date & Time: 05/02/90 19:23:36 Message Number 4156 I usually remain in my bed when I'm passed out, except when my friends are feeling particularly sadistic, and decide to see where they can put me w/o me noticing. - Corwyn =========== From: CORWYN OF AMBER To: CHIP P. UNICORN Subject: money Date & Time: 05/02/90 19:25:02 Message Number 4157 And generally it's more fun.. you just have to keep from getting caught. (It does happen occasionally.. those pesky police) - Corwyn =========== From: CORWYN OF AMBER To: BEATLE Subject: God... Date & Time: 05/02/90 19:28:15 Message Number 4158 Condoms at every corner!!! Condoms beside every bed!! Remember: "If you're not going to sack it, Go home and whack it!" Courtesy of the Condom Week Slogans List. - Corwyn =========== From: C.C.A. To: CORWYN OF AMBER Subject: God... Date & Time: 05/02/90 22:47:57 Message Number 4161 Good job CORWYN!!!!! =========== From: TURTLE To: C.C.A. Subject: Foo Date & Time: 05/02/90 23:26:01 Message Number 4162 Every rule has an exception except this one: A man must be present in order to be shaved. =========== From: TURTLE To: CHIP P. UNICORN Subject: money Date & Time: 05/02/90 23:26:51 Message Number 4163 >...making money illegally without hurting anyone still sounds much >easier than making money legally without hurting anyone. Nope. =========== From: TURTLE To: BEATLE Subject: Fantasia Date & Time: 05/02/90 23:29:33 Message Number 4164 Taping movies with a video recorder inevidably yeilds disappointing results: the movie is being projectected at 24 frames per second, the camcorder is running at 30 fps, so inevidably you're going to end up with blank frames on the tape or frames that were shot while the shutter was opening or closing. (At a minimum, you'll get six frames a second that are messed up, in fact.) Wouldn't it be easier to simply "borrow" a print? --A practical Turtle =========== From: TURTLE To: CORWYN OF AMBER Subject: Real solutions Date & Time: 05/02/90 23:32:35 Message Number 4165 Tsk tsk tsk. Don't you know that birth control is immoral? It's against God's will, you see. If you don't believe it, ask anyone who's standing in a picket line waving "Stop Abortions Now;" they generally seem to be the people most stridently opposed to birth control. (And Heaven KNOWS we musn't permit public education about birth control, because that would make more people want to have sex...) --A baffled Turtle This message brought to you by the Committee for Mindless Morality, Inc; an affiliate of We Sold Our Brains For God, Ltd. =========== From: CORWYN OF AMBER To: TURTLE Subject: Real solutions Date & Time: 05/03/90 02:12:09 Message Number 4166 I just can't understand how they can let places like this exist! Why I've seen the "S" word five times, and that nasty boy used the "C" word twice! You will all burn in HELL for your blasphemy! (No, Turtle's aren't excluded from HELL, they just can't go to Heaven) - Corwyn Courtesy: Fire and Brimstone Unlimited. =========== From: CHIP P. UNICORN To: ALL Subject: Suncoast City Date & Time: 05/03/90 08:38:02 Message Number 4167 Does anyone know what happened to Suncoast City? Every time I call -- no matter what the baud rate, I just get garbage before it hangs up. (This never happened before -- I doubt it's on my end of the line.) Chip P. Unicorn =========== From: CHIP P. UNICORN To: BEATLE Subject: article Date & Time: 05/03/90 08:41:48 Message Number 4168 Hmmm... I can't think of any instances where Jerry spoke... Can anyone out there in BBS-land think of an example? Chip P. Unicorn =========== From: CHIP P. UNICORN To: CORWYN OF AMBER Subject: -=*><*=- Date & Time: 05/03/90 08:43:23 Message Number 4169 >...and decide to see where they can put me w/o noticing... Unfortunately, you keep waking up before we can rest your bed on any telephone wires... Chip P. Unicorn =========== From: CHIP P. UNICORN To: CORWYN OF AMBER Subject: Real solutions Date & Time: 05/03/90 08:48:35 Message Number 4170 Ya know, the more I think about it, the more interesting of a place Hell sounds like, and the more boring Heaven is. But I wouldn't touch Purgatory. All those people waiting around to get into such a boring place sound even worse. Chip P. Unicorn Is there a Purgatory for Hell? =========== From: C.C.A. To: TURTLE Subject: Foo Date & Time: 05/03/90 16:23:44 Message Number 4171 You are FUNNY (but looks aren't everything) =========== From: C.C.A. To: CORWYN OF AMBER Subject: Real solutions Date & Time: 05/03/90 16:27:55 Message Number 4172 AMEN! PREACH IT! =========== From: C.C.A. To: CHIP P. UNICORN Subject: Real solutions Date & Time: 05/03/90 16:29:07 Message Number 4173 I'd rather not take that chance. Do you like to PARTY?? If you do, HEAVEN won't be a boring place at all. Pensonally, I'm rather looking forward to an eternal party. Besides, who in their right minds would want to take a bath in fire forever? --An anticipating C.C.A. =========== From: DONTHEN To: ALL Subject: WARNING Date & Time: 05/03/90 17:05:24 Message Number 4174 ** **..** **......** **..........** **....PEOPLE....** **..WITHOUT A CLUE..** **...ON BOARD...** **..........** **......** **..** ** =========== From: ACAPULCO To: CHIP P. UNICORN Subject: Pee Wee Date & Time: 05/03/90 17:39:05 Message Number 4175 It figures you would... he who won't pass up one stinkin' weekend with his girlfriend for a once-in-a-blue-moon opportunity like a road rally! {Acapulco} =========== From: CHIP P. UNICORN To: C.C.A. Subject: Real solutions Date & Time: 05/03/90 18:33:18 Message Number 4176 Dear C.C.A., A few points of explanation: I am a born-again Christian, who believes in the truth of the Bible. However, that does NOT prevent me from strongly disagreeing with many things going on with the church. (Jim and Tammy Bakker aren't the only thing...) I have been less "turned on" to organized religion since last summer, when I helped organize and create a church in Mexico -- then helped destroy it. (The second was unintentional, but I believe it was really the will of God.) People who all share exactly the same opinion bore me. I despise clones. Many Christian churches, however, seem to want to repress the individuality that God has given us. (Take a look at hair styles around your church...) Many Christian churches only reach out to the people they want to be seen with... the white, upper class. Hell, at least, is non-discriminating. There will be thousands of interesting people. Some hideous, yes -- but probably many people who considered themselves to be "good." (If you follow the idea that it's only belief in Jesus that will get one into Heaven.) The thoroughly evil people might be the most fascinating to talk with: why did Hitler do what he did? And so forth... I assume from your comments that you feel you'll be going to Heaven. I also assume from your comments that you feel Hell will be a lake of fire (from Revelations.) I have one question for you: Why should a non-believer accept any of those teachings? (Please, PLEASE don't say, "Because the Bible says so." I hate circular reasoning...) Chip P. Unicorn =========== From: CHIP P. UNICORN To: ACAPULCO Subject: Pee Wee Date & Time: 05/03/90 18:46:10 Message Number 4177 Dear Acapulco, I shall be seeing my girlfriend only twice more before I take off for Washington this summer. Gimme a break! Chip P. Unicorn =========== From: RUFUS To: ACAPULCO Subject: Pee Wee Date & Time: 05/03/90 18:56:42 Message Number 4178 And to think me and Zot will be rushing over from the SAT's to do this Road Rally. Don't be surprised if we yell things like "The answer is C" to passers-by. BTW, just where is the meeting point? I'd like to know. I'll probably meet Zot at Turtles [Turtle says "Hey, hold on, just what do you think your doing?"] Anyways, off to study for a test. Ackk... =========== From: CORWYN OF AMBER To: CHIP P. UNICORN Subject: -=*><*=- Date & Time: 05/03/90 19:08:54 Message Number 4180 Yea, and the ogre you borrowed to carry my waterbed get's hungry and leaves before I go back to sleep. - Corwyn =========== From: CORWYN OF AMBER To: CHIP P. UNICORN Subject: Real solutions Date & Time: 05/03/90 19:09:59 Message Number 4181 Yea.. but you might have some fun being an Evangelist in purgatory.. talk about people who are /really/ nervous. - Corwyn =========== From: CORWYN OF AMBER To: C.C.A. Subject: Real solutions Date & Time: 05/03/90 19:11:18 Message Number 4182 Hmm.. It'd be convenient for 24hr Hot Dog service.. or you could just slap a hamburger patty on a fellow sinner's back, wait 5 minutess, and Voila! Fried Hamburger. What a wonderful thought. - Corwyn =========== From: JONBOY To: TURTLE Subject: C Stuff Date & Time: 05/03/90 20:20:29 Message Number 4187 Tell ya what - the compiler that I am thinking about for CP/M is the Software Toolworks C compiler and it leaves its' output as ---- (hold onto your shorts ) Assembler source with C comments!!!! TA DA! How's that for a compromise? I will make an effort to get my stuff together and dig it out. JonBoy =========== From: JONBOY To: TURTLE Subject: Radar Detectors Date & Time: 05/03/90 20:35:41 Message Number 4188 Yup the only 2 states that have attempted to subvert your rights to the FREE airwaves are Virginia and New Jersey. It is in fact illegal ands will subject you to a $250 fine and confiscation of your detector in Virginia. New Jersey is second hand. A low-flyin JonBoy =========== From: JONBOY To: TURTLE Subject: ** HA ! ** Date & Time: 05/03/90 20:39:12 Message Number 4189 could your compiler class have anything to do with a bad case of compilerphobia? Seriously - I really loved my compilers class. We had to do a machine that ran "ToyCode". Then we had to write an assembler for said ToyCode and then implement a BASIC compiler using the assembler then we had to write an application that used the BASIC. My application was a simple Sieve of Erathonese (sp?). My buddy and I were gonna do the whole damned thing in YACC and LEX but there are pitifully few texts on either of these so we had to do a banzai job as the finals approached A memorable quarter. JonBoy =========== From: JONBOY To: CHIP P. UNICORN Subject: No No ! Please Date & Time: 05/03/90 20:45:17 Message Number 4190 I have a seek and destroy missile aimed at your house should you fire up the abortion issue again! The last one damn near killed me from sheer ennui at seeing page after page of standard drivel. Face it: abortion is an emotional issue and as such cannot be argued logically, effectively or rationally. Please let it die!!! A freaked out JonBoy =========== From: JONBOY To: YNGLING Subject: Good News! Date & Time: 05/03/90 20:54:26 Message Number 4191 I'd chip in! Y'think he ever heard of Frankie? =========== From: JONBOY To: CHIP P. UNICORN Subject: article Date & Time: 05/03/90 21:12:52 Message Number 4192 I seem to recall Jerry uttering a noise similar to "Hey!" to get Tom'a attention - been so long tho =========== From: ANGEL To: YNGLING Subject: New crusade Date & Time: 05/04/90 00:58:02 Message Number 4193 > To this new crusade I solemnly pledge ... Ye Gods, not another new crusade! I'm rapidly approachig 'cause' burn-out. Earth Day was the last straw, how about a moon-day or something? =========== From: SNAKEBYTE To: YNGLING Subject: TURTLE POWER! Date & Time: 05/04/90 01:26:14 Message Number 4194 >Cowabunga dude. Used as a quote from TEENAGE MUTANT NINJA TURTLES, not a quote from me. As for the origins, I'm not sure. But the first time I saw it, it was on a poster in a freinds dorm room in '75 with Snoopy shootin' a tube sayin' it.....What are you offering Ken?!?!?!?! =========== From: SNAKEBYTE To: CORWYN OF AMBER Subject: -=*><*=- Date & Time: 05/04/90 01:29:24 Message Number 4195 I know I'm not drunk.....I can lay on the floor WITHOUT holding on! My friends never 'put' me anywhere, but they have put other people with me without me noticing......yuck!!! =========== From: SNAKEBYTE To: TURTLE Subject: MESSAGES Date & Time: 05/04/90 01:32:54 Message Number 4196 Hey, shelled one.....I just was told that I had a message waiting #4186 and I find a gap existing between message 4182 and 4187. Just curious what happened??? =========== From: CORWYN OF AMBER To: SNAKEBYTE Subject: -=*><*=- Date & Time: 05/04/90 08:05:02 Message Number 4197 Yeah.. Coyote syndrome.. you want to knaw off your arm to avoid waking up the thing thats sleeping next to you.. those are the mornings that drive me to drinking /before/ 8am. - Corwyn =========== From: TURTLE To: CHIP P. UNICORN Subject: Unreal Problems Date & Time: 05/04/90 14:44:07 Message Number 4199 >Is there a Purgatory for Hell? No, buit there is a waiting list to get a Ferrari F-40. =========== From: TURTLE To: C.C.A. Subject: Foo Date & Time: 05/04/90 14:44:58 Message Number 4200 >You are FUNNY (but looks aren't everything) I shan't respond to that; I try to make it a point not to attack unarmed opponents. =========== From: TURTLE To: C.C.A. Subject: Real solutions Date & Time: 05/04/90 14:46:35 Message Number 4201 >...who in their right minds would want to take a bath in fire forever? Who in their right minds would worship a being who sees fit to keep a private torture chamber for His mistakes? I for one expect higher standards from any deity I would worship than that... =========== From: TURTLE To: RUFUS Subject: Road Stuff Date & Time: 05/04/90 14:49:42 Message Number 4202 The meeting point is the Klockner-Bartelt parking lot on DeSoto about a stone's throw from my apartment, as the crow flies over green fields and eats the lovely butterflies. If you're meeting here first, you can follow me over... =========== From: TURTLE To: JONBOY Subject: C Stuff Date & Time: 05/04/90 14:51:45 Message Number 4203 >...and it leaves it's output as...Assembler source with C comments!!!! 8080 or Z-80 assembler? I have a couple of really good Z-80-specific macro assemblers, but the only 8080 assembler I have is ASM... --A Z-80 Turtle =========== From: TURTLE To: JONBOY Subject: Radar Detectors Date & Time: 05/04/90 14:53:41 Message Number 4204 Actually, radar detectors are also illegal in Connecticut... when you drive into the state, there's a little tiny sign that says "Welcome to Connecticut" and an enormous sign that says "RADAR DETECTORS ILLEGAL." Some greeting. =========== From: TURTLE To: SNAKEBYTE Subject: MESSAGES Date & Time: 05/04/90 14:56:35 Message Number 4205 #4186 might be a mail message... =========== From: DM2 To: SNAKEBYTE Subject: -=*><*=- Date & Time: 05/04/90 16:07:45 Message Number 4206 Sheesh, and I know *someone* with a hard copy of me at my best... Drunk as a skunk (actually, I'm *not* a skunk...) and online. He uses it to keep me in line. =========== From: DM2 To: TURTLE Subject: ::sigh:: Date & Time: 05/04/90 16:18:40 Message Number 4207 In regards to the downloading problems y'all are having... Not only can I not download or upload software, but I can't even download a terminal program to allow me to u/l or d/l the software. It's a vicious circle, but I'm working on it. I have one on order from a friend... (The first disk he sent me was blank.) Anybody have any ideas on how to upload and download using Deskmate? (Like I said, I'm working on it.) Gawd, this software is driving me *nuts*. I can't even get it to u/l or d/l with another version of Deskmate. The only thing I can do right now is go across the PC-Link lines, and as we all know, *that* is less than cheap. Hmmmm I wonder if Link has a copy of Procom. Anybody know another good program for a Tandy for terminal software? Hehe just point me in the right direction... --a Frustrated DM.... =========== From: RUFUS To: ANGEL Subject: New crusade Date & Time: 05/04/90 17:55:23 Message Number 4209 >how about a moon-day or something? Would this involve running around mooning people?! People've told me I have cute rear parts... =========== From: RUFUS To: TURTLE Subject: Road Stuff Date & Time: 05/04/90 17:59:26 Message Number 4210 O.K. That sounds cool. Just incase, isn't Klockner-Bartelt a left turn from your house (i.e.-west of 301). =========== From: BEATLE To: TURTLE Subject: Fantasia Date & Time: 05/04/90 18:49:24 Message Number 4211 >30 frames... I thought video had MORE frames than film. Anyway, the film I shot did look a little cheap, but if the lighting was changed a bit, a film shot off a screen could come out okay... =========== From: BEATLE To: TURTLE Subject: Fantasia Date & Time: 05/04/90 18:51:34 Message Number 4212 FORGIVE ME I screwed up... I realize 30 is more than 24, but I thought video had closer to 60 frames... forgive my mistake... =========== From: JONBOY To: TURTLE Subject: C Stuff Date & Time: 05/04/90 19:16:07 Message Number 4213 Actually I believe it leaves it's output as 8080 and even has it's own assembler as part of the package. I have a couple of translators that I will vouch for that convert 8080 to Z-80 (which is the only assembler a sane being would choose). Take yer pick. I seem to recall that I was happy with it's performance but time sweetens all bad things - even my first wife doesn't seem like quite an ogre anymore. =========== From: JONBOY To: TURTLE Subject: Radar Detectors Date & Time: 05/04/90 19:19:24 Message Number 4214 I guess the thought they said Hi first is what counts... =========== From: JONBOY To: LADY IN BLACK Subject: Earth calling.. Date & Time: 05/04/90 19:22:33 Message Number 4215 Ok Let's guess: 1) Still sick? Hope ya get better. advice: chickn soup wLOTSA garlic! 2) Lurking? What evil lurks in the hearts of... 3) Kidnapped? We'll get a collection up. 4) Blue Flu? We'll get together for a drink. 5) Busy? Chill out with a leisurely stroll down the beach. 6) Tired? Put up a hammock between two palms on the beach - guaranteed! 7) Other.... there's always a solution. But the important thing is to get back on track.. Ciao! JonBoy =========== From: RAVEN To: SNAKEBYTE Subject: rOAD rALLY..... Date & Time: 05/04/90 19:50:55 Message Number 4216 It now looks like I will be busy until 6:30 saturday. Hackers garage sale at Computer Annex, and Don always has a few good deals about (he and a few other people clean their closets then). Raven =========== From: RAVEN To: RUFUS Subject: Gee..... Date & Time: 05/04/90 19:53:31 Message Number 4217 Watts et al. talked me out of it. Besides, unless I add a table in the living room it will be dificult to set up the machines I already have, let alone add a 1 ton 6 foot tall rack (although I am thinking of rackmounting some of my current machines, and putting a Hackintosh in one after I sell my plus). Raven =========== From: RUFUS To: JONBOY Subject: Earth calling.. Date & Time: 05/04/90 21:03:12 Message Number 4218 You forgot one: 8) School? Run around your front yard impersonating animals like the dodo bird and a frog. Make lotsa noise while doing this. Abusing things like vegetables also helps. =========== From: RUFUS To: RAVEN Subject: Gee..... Date & Time: 05/04/90 21:05:47 Message Number 4219 Like, you wouldn't have an extra 1200 baud modem around that Watts could have. I'd really like mine back sometime within a month. First I have to get a serial card for the Apple to run the modem. If you happen to come across one cheap, please tell me. =========== From: JONBOY To: RAVEN Subject: Garage sale? Date & Time: 05/04/90 22:25:54 Message Number 4221 Where is this computer annex? When is the sale ((drooolllll slobber!)) =========== From: JONBOY To: RUFUS Subject: Earth calling.. Date & Time: 05/04/90 22:27:28 Message Number 4222 Your right! I /did/ forget school! Silly me... I used to disappear for weeks right before finals. Usually the realization would pop into my head as I was doing something sinful (ie nuttin to do with school) that I had better get my ass in gear or bye bye GPA! PANIC! I guess I'm a procrastinator at heart... Give Lady my best if ya see her. =========== From: JONBOY To: RUFUS Subject: Deal Date & Time: 05/04/90 22:30:28 Message Number 4223 I have a Prometheus (Hayes compat) internal 1200 baud modem that needs no serial card as it is built in. I doubt that I'll be using my Apple for telecomm so it is for sale. I also have LOTS of Apple software like 600 disks of the stuff (both sides) I'm sure we can find some terminal software for it too. Probably ASCII Express is the best but I also have MouseTerm somewhere. =========== From: DONTHEN To: DM2 Subject: ::sigh:: Date & Time: 05/04/90 22:39:59 Message Number 4224 Deskmate knows no standard transfer protocols. It's a cute environment, and can be fairly good for some things, but you need to get a "real" terminal program to do anything off of PC-Link. I suggest you find somebody who can give you a copy of Telix, which is a "shareware" terminal program. (It doesn't interface with Deskmate, but it's fairly easy to use and is pretty powerful.) There are some other neat terminals out there for MS-DOS machines but a lot of them are slow, really big, and overpriced, or any combination of those three. =========== From: BEATLE To: ANGEL Subject: New crusade Date & Time: 05/04/90 23:37:49 Message Number 4225 > moon-day or something... We can't have that until we're living there and destroying the place!! =========== From: CORWYN OF AMBER To: DM2 Subject: Telix Date & Time: 05/05/90 00:35:40 Message Number 4226 Ps.. if you /can/ get something d/l'ed at all.. you can get Telix from my board: The Shadow @ (813) 359-1717.. Hmmm.. I saw a GWbasic Xmodem CRC implementation somewhere.. you could call, and just fire that up... If I find it.. I'll let you know. - Corwyn =========== From: TURTLE To: RUFUS Subject: Road Stu Date & Time: 05/05/90 04:07:33 Message Number 4230 Yes, Klockner-Bartlet is in fact left from my complex...real easy to find, nooo problem. =========== From: TURTLE To: JONBOY Subject: Garage Sale! Date & Time: 05/05/90 04:10:37 Message Number 4231 Comuter Annex is located on US 41 south (waaaaaaay south) of almost everything else in Sarasota, down by Inacomp. It's just north of Inacomp on the same side of the road, in the micromall right by Taco Bell. I don't know if the hacker's garage sale is going on there or not, though. =========== From: ACAPULCO To: CHIP P. UNICORN Subject: Pee Wee Date & Time: 05/05/90 09:40:58 Message Number 4232 > Gimme a break! Okay, where do you want it? Arm? Leg? How 'bout the back? ]:) {Acapulco} =========== From: ACAPULCO To: CORWYN OF AMBER Subject: -=*><*=- Date & Time: 05/05/90 09:44:40 Message Number 4233 Coyote syndrome? I've heard that described as "wolf ugly". {Acapulco} =========== From: ACAPULCO To: DM2 Subject: ::sigh:: Date & Time: 05/05/90 09:46:56 Message Number 4234 You can't (u/l or d/l w/Deskmate)... it isn't a pretty sight! I used to try it in my golden days of (using the preferred term around here) Mush-DOS, then broke down and bought Crosstalk XVI _just_ so I'd have Xmodem so I could d/l something _decent_! {Acapulco} =========== From: DONTHEN To: ACAPULCO Subject: ::sigh:: Date & Time: 05/05/90 12:44:38 Message Number 4235 Wow, someone who actually /bought/ a terminal program? Neat. I hear rumors of things like that... (Of ocurse, before Turtle met me he thought manuals for NEWDOS/80 were mythical creatures.) Deskmate does have a pretty sad excuse for a terminal program--there's a pop-up one for the TRS-80 somewhere that does XMODEM Checksum--but hey, PBBS has a pretty sad excuse for a file transfer system, so she doesn't have too far to go match it.... =========== From: SAURON To: SNAKEBYTE Subject: thermodynamics Date & Time: 05/05/90 15:29:36 Message Number 4236 Or "Blue Coal..." or "Luckies taste taste better, cleaner, fresher smoother..." or "Hawkaaaaaaa!" or "All right Secret Squadron members- today's secret message is..." or maybe even "Lucky Strike Green has gone to war". (that one is befor even MY time) =========== From: SAURON To: ANGEL Subject: dirt, she says? Date & Time: 05/05/90 15:35:10 Message Number 4237 Okay...Feel like doing anything really kinky next weekend? =========== From: SAURON To: TURTLE Subject: Binkley Date & Time: 05/05/90 15:37:54 Message Number 4238 The only thing I've ever seen that is remotely as ugly as Binkley was a crippled Screech Owl with a patch over one eye, the mange, the dreaded 'crotch-feather mould' and Avarian A.I.D.S. Binkley is the electronic equivalent of masochism. =========== From: SAURON To: TURTLE Subject: Foo Date & Time: 05/05/90 15:43:47 Message Number 4239 An exception to the exception - >a man has to be present in order to be shaved. "Pete Rose took it on the chin today with N.C. state's point-shaving scandal..." -Jimmy the Greek =========== From: SAURON To: TURTLE Subject: Hard Drives Date & Time: 05/05/90 15:49:20 Message Number 4240 Hmmmm, could be, I suppose. I am not an expert on hard drives... yet. In a month or two, I may disagree. =========== From: SAURON To: KEN OBER Subject: * HA! * Date & Time: 05/05/90 15:51:35 Message Number 4241 Gee, if CBM continues in this direction, they may get right up there with Apple as far as over-priced hardware. It's great stuff-granted, but remember when the C-64 was 600 dollars? I'll pass for right now. I take that back...I already HAVE passed. =========== From: CORWYN OF AMBER To: ACAPULCO Subject: -=*><*=- Date & Time: 05/05/90 17:13:16 Message Number 4242 I think we're describing the same situation... a scary one at that. - Corwyn =========== From: CORWYN OF AMBER To: ACAPULCO Subject: ::sigh:: Date & Time: 05/05/90 17:14:15 Message Number 4243 Don't tell me you're using ugh.. Crosstalk?? That's pitiful. The only thing it has over /any/ other package is it's script capability.. and Telix's are not quite as powerful.. but much more logically arranged.. SALT (telix's script language) looks (and works) pretty much like 'C' it's also about a third the cost of Xtalk and has Zmodem built in.. sheesh.. why would anybody do Xtalk? - Corwyn =========== From: C.C.A. To: CHIP P. UNICORN Subject: Real solutions Date & Time: 05/05/90 18:37:52 Message Number 4244 Sorry,during my last reply I was cut off. As to your question, why shouldn't they? If a person can believe that KILLING an innocent child is right, they should all be even more acceptant to the prospect of living forever. =========== From: C.C.A. To: CORWYN OF AMBER Subject: Real solutions Date & Time: 05/05/90 18:47:26 Message Number 4245 It's amazing how people can pervert anything. =========== From: C.C.A. To: TURTLE Subject: Foo Date & Time: 05/05/90 18:51:24 Message Number 4246 Have mercy, please. =========== From: C.C.A. To: TURTLE Subject: Real solutions Date & Time: 05/05/90 18:53:36 Message Number 4247 Who do YOU worship?? =========== From: TURTLE To: SAURON Subject: Binkley Date & Time: 05/05/90 20:07:38 Message Number 4248 Calling Binkley "electronic masochism" is being far, far too kind... Binkley is more like the electronic equivalent of the Spanish Inquisition. =========== From: TURTLE To: C.C.A. Subject: Real solutions Date & Time: 05/05/90 20:12:15 Message Number 4249 >If a person can believe that KILLING an innocent child is right, they >should all be even more acceptant to the prospect of living forever. Huh? That sentence /looks/ like it's written in English, but damned if I can figure out what it's trying to say...Folks, with 1990 having only seven months left to go, I think we've already seen the Non-Sequitur of the Year... =========== From: TURTLE To: C.C.A. Subject: Real dips Date & Time: 05/05/90 20:17:17 Message Number 4250 >Who do YOU worship? Nobody. =========== From: C.C.A. To: TURTLE Subject: Real dips Date & Time: 05/05/90 20:21:02 Message Number 4251 That did not seem to answer the question. Everyone worships SOMETHING Even Turtles. =========== From: RUFUS To: JONBOY Subject: Deal Date & Time: 05/05/90 22:20:34 Message Number 4253 If I'm not mis-taken, the Prometheus modem will not work with GBBS Pro, which is what I'll be running. I have a modem, I just need to get it back. I use ProTERM to call BBSs. ProTERM is a wonderful program. =========== From: CORWYN OF AMBER To: C.C.A. Subject: Real solutions Date & Time: 05/05/90 22:37:47 Message Number 4254 What are you referring to specifically? I /can/ pervert almost anything... most of the time however, I just make fun of it. - Corwyn =========== From: CORWYN OF AMBER To: C.C.A. Subject: Real dips Date & Time: 05/05/90 22:40:08 Message Number 4255 Nope.. as a token Amberite.. I can assure you that not /everybody/ worships something.. I don't happen to worship anything.. I have enourmous admiration for both The Unicorn, and Carmen Berg.. but worshipping anything seems really silly to me.. a few individuals have acheived a quasi-demi-god status in my life.. but nobody's seemed worth worshipping. Agnostically Yours, Corwyn =========== From: ACAPULCO To: DONTHEN Subject: ::sigh:: Date & Time: 05/05/90 23:07:38 Message Number 4256 If one can use Xmodem Checksum with Deskmate, then one doesn't need to buy something else... I had to because I did not know any BBS people personally (at the time) using MS-DOS, and had no other way to get at the files I wanted. I ended up using Crosstalk for about a year, before getting on the beta list for COM-AND. I enjoyed the program I stuck with it after the formal release and through numerous revisions. {Acapulco} =========== From: ACAPULCO To: CORWYN OF AMBER Subject: ::sigh:: Date & Time: 05/05/90 23:14:05 Message Number 4257 Folks use Crosstalk when they can't get ahold of anything else, and the alternative is Deskmate. Fear not, I've ditched Crosstalk in favor of COM-AND, which has a good script system, a unique set of accessories, and Zmodem support, to name a few advantages. I also know the author. {Acapulco} (Capt of the famous Rally winning team of Turtle, Donthen & Acapulco) =========== From: DONTHEN To: C.C.A. Subject: Real solutions Date & Time: 05/06/90 02:03:40 Message Number 4258 > If a person can believe that KILLING an innocent child is right, > they should all be even more acceptant to the prospect of living > forever. If a person believes destroying entire ecosystems for commercial gain is right, he should be even more inclined to like pineapple on his Domino's pizzas. --- The two statements above have one thing in common: their latter halves have no apparent connection to their former halves. Pardon my apparent ignorance, sirrah, but what in tarnation does abortion have to do with immortality? Why should supporting abortion rights make one more likely to believe in an afterlife? If that isn't what you meant to say, you need to do some serious clarification. =========== From: SCOTT E To: CRYSTAL Subject: whats new Date & Time: 05/06/90 10:11:41 Message Number 4259 HI crystal:) where have ya been? Things have been a little dull around here this week not much action. So how is eckerds doing? thats good well my exciting week consisted of seeing pretty woman. thats it. I start back to school monday at usf. yeckkkkkkk. have a great week seeeeeee yaaaaaaaaa' =========== From: JONBOY To: RUFUS Subject: Deal Date & Time: 05/06/90 11:16:35 Message Number 4260 Hmmm isn't proTERM that nasty piece of crap written under the UCSD system in Pascal? At any rate - I have all sorts of stuff for modems on the Apple including GBBS, ABBS, a lot of stuff for the truly wonderful Apple Cat modem, ASCII Express, and a couple of things that run under ProDOS by Roger Wagner Software. JonBoy =========== From: JONBOY To: CORWYN OF AMBER Subject: Real dips Date & Time: 05/06/90 11:21:06 Message Number 4261 If you truly believe that worshipping ANYTHING or ANYBODY is silly ... then commit yourself and refrain from being an agnostic. This middle of the road stance will not get you anywhere. You will be in a limbo of your own making. Either come to the conclusion that God exists or he doesn't. I personally KNOW that God exists and takes an interest in our lives. I have had things happen to me that simplistic ideas such as syncronicity and serendipity simply look silly as explanations. The first step is to look at the evidence which is our Holy Bible. (I am starting from the Christian viewpoint because it is the one true faith of the living God - we can discuss other faiths or schisms within /orthodox/ Christianity if you like - but for simplicity's sake, I start with the truth). The Bible has undergone a test of almost 2000 years. The literature has been validated and substantiated more than ANY other other written work in the entire history of mankind as far as correlation and accuracy (yes! historical accuracy). Given this unprecedented book we must examine a most startling claim that it makes: It is the written word of the Creator of this universe and it outlines His plan for His creations. This is the evidence that you must examine with an open mind and a lot of inner searching. It kills me the number of people that believe that their intellects are keenly honed instruments capable of infinite perception of the cosmos and make such a rash claim : "There is NO God!" from the pitiful examples of their own lives within the limitations of a most likely restricted environment. Most Atheists that I know - can quote the Bible inside out and know every tiny piece that seems to contradict some other tiny piece. Fine - that is what they were looking for and that is what they found. I ask that if you really want to know the truth for yourself - the read with an open mind. JonBoy =========== From: RUFUS To: JONBOY Subject: Deal Date & Time: 05/06/90 13:07:10 Message Number 4262 I dunno what ProTERM is written in, but I like it. I know several people who like it. I used to have an AppleCat modem, but the damn thing would never hang-up the phone, and after sending to to California 3-4 times I gave up on it. What's ABBS? The name sounds familiar, but I don't think I've seen it. =========== From: KEN OBER To: SAURON Subject: You Dweeb... Date & Time: 05/06/90 14:36:04 Message Number 4263 actually, the computer is very /low/ priced -- Compare it to it's /closest/ competetor ... The Mac II FX which is something like $10000 now, isn't it? Gee, too bad you got a 286 -- But hey, not all of us can have computers that haven't been updated since 1950.... =========== From: CHIP P. UNICORN To: TURTLE Subject: Version # Date & Time: 05/06/90 21:29:48 Message Number 4264 Noticed that your BBS version number went up from 2.02H to 3.00H. Congratulations. Chip P. Unicorn =========== From: CHIP P. UNICORN To: CORWYN OF AMBER Subject: -=*><*=- Date & Time: 05/06/90 21:31:12 Message Number 4265 Ogre? To carry a waterbed? I'll have ytou know that it took TEN unicorns to try to drag that waterbed out of yor room... then a lot fewer when we thought of taking the water out... and, we were all kinda thirsty... But I won't say what we re-filled the bed with... Chip P. Unicorn =========== From: CHIP P. UNICORN To: CORWYN OF AMBER Subject: Real solutions Date & Time: 05/06/90 21:34:12 Message Number 4266 Being an Evangelist in Purgatory sounds like fun; that is, until the people in Purgatory figure out WHY you're in Purgatory... Chip P. Unicorn =========== From: CHIP P. UNICORN To: JONBOY Subject: No No ! Please Date & Time: 05/06/90 21:36:18 Message Number 4267 >Please let it die. I'll abort it, even before it's given birth. Chip P. Unicorn =========== From: CHIP P. UNICORN To: RUFUS Subject: New crusade Date & Time: 05/06/90 21:42:15 Message Number 4268 >Would this involve mooning peop[le?! I've never understood the humans' need to wear clothing. Chip P. Unicorn =========== From: CHIP P. UNICORN To: C.C.A. Subject: Real solutions Date & Time: 05/06/90 21:49:54 Message Number 4269 >Why shouldn't they? I assume the question you're referring to is why should unbelievers believe the Bible... Why shouldn't unbelievers believe the Bible? Well, it's self contradictory, it's historically questionable, it's misogynist, it's scientifically naive, possibly inaccurate, extremely ethnocentric and nationalistic, depressing, does not solve the "Problem of Evil," and lacks unity. Any questions? Chip P. Unicorn =========== From: CHIP P. UNICORN To: C.C.A. Subject: Foo Date & Time: 05/06/90 21:58:22 Message Number 4270 Have mercy? What, you who worship the same God that slew Ananias -- not for not giving -- but for not giving enough? You, who worship the samee God who slew forty-two youths when they called Elisha "baldy"? The God who has about half the psalms devoted to Him rather bloodthirty ones? Watch your own deity, mister. Chip P. Unicorn =========== From: CHIP P. UNICORN To: JONBOY Subject: Real dips Date & Time: 05/06/90 22:06:31 Message Number 4271 Whoa, Nellie... Hold me back... Hold me back... First of all, how do you "know" that God exists? What kind of proof do you have? If it's personal experience -- are your senses always correct? (If I gave you LSD, and you "felt the presence of God" while you were under LSD -- would that be a true experience?) Even the great scholar Charles Ryrie (ever heard of the Ryrie study Bible?) Admits in his "Basic Theology" that the Bible has, at least, scribal errors. (Basic Theology, p. 98, by Charles C. Ryrie, Sp Publications, 1986) There were at least scribal errors from the numbers: why not elsewhere? How do we know that the Bible is the "one true faith" as you put it? Why not, say, Zoroastrianism? (Which, I might add, was looked on with favor in your Bible. The first part of the first Chapter of John might have come straight from a Zoroastrian service. Heck: MOST of John parallels Zoroaster rather nicely.) It's survived 500 years longer than the New Testament -- and it still has worshippers. Hinduism goes back even father (but there's no, real continuous faiths that survived from then 'till now.) Buddhism has lasted some 3000 years, too... You say the Bible is historically accurate? I wonder: would you please prove that any of the miracles mentioned happened? If you can't, how do you know they were historically accurate? Face it -- Christianity requires a LOT of faith to believe in. Even from the start. But, I'm afraid that it's most Christians who come from the "restricted environment" you were talking about. You see more Christians in rural areas than in large university towns. The Devil's Advocate =========== From: CHIP P. UNICORN To: ALL CHRISTIANS Subject: What I'm doing. Date & Time: 05/06/90 22:20:17 Message Number 4272 Okay, okay... just looking over the last few messages, I'm sure I riled up some Christians on this board. I'm sure most of them are wondering exactly what I'm doing: especially when I mentioned only a few messages back that I was, myself, a born-again Christian. I am. I also have not found one shred of evidence to support my belief, in the sense that I've found many arguments why NOT to believe the Bible. Anyone who claims to have proofs for the Bible generally get plowed under by arguments I've been storing up. And I try to say them in vicious (sp?) enough ways that they can't be ignored. If there's reason NOT to believe the Bible -- and not strong reasons TO believe the Bible, why should I place my faith in something so shaky? SUre -- God may be beyond logic; but mortal minds refuse to understand anything beyond that. And if not the least bit of Him is understandable, then He's not worth worshipping. (Ya might as well worship outer space -- or the tachyon.) (Some of you might say: well -- parts of Him are within logic, and parts of Him are beyond logic. Nope. No can do. If parts of Him are self-contradictory -- the only way He can be beyond logic -- then, from logic, ANYTHING can be proved about Him. I'll give the proof if someone asks for it.) Anyone got a suggestion? Chip P. Unicorn And, no -- I'm not looking for sarcastic ones. =========== From: TURTLE To: C.C.A. Subject: Real weird Date & Time: 05/07/90 00:33:45 Message Number 4273 >Everyone worships SOMETHING >Even Turtles. Even Turtles are worshipped? Groovy, dude! I want to meet some of the people you know...Turtle worship is just the ultimate natural high, you know? =========== From: TURTLE To: RUFUS Subject: ProTERM Date & Time: 05/07/90 00:37:33 Message Number 4274 >ProTERM is a wonderful program. ProTERM can make you happy. ProTERM is the Way. ProTERM is warm, sensitive, caring, and great with leftover pizza. ProTERM is the Way to Happiness and Pizza. Everyone should use ProTERM. Even people without Apples. ProTERM can make their lives complete. ProTERM is your friend. (c) 1990 People United for ProTERM, Inc. Failure to use ProTERM is treason. =========== From: TURTLE To: CORWYN OF AMBER Subject: Real People Date & Time: 05/07/90 00:39:51 Message Number 4275 >...nobody's seemed worth worshipping. Not even Seymour Cray? =========== From: TURTLE To: JONBOY Subject: Real dips Date & Time: 05/07/90 00:42:16 Message Number 4276 Oooooh! "Let us start with Christianity, which is the Truth." I /like/ that! At least you don't beat around the bush. But, moving along from there: First, I am not convinced that you "know" that Christianity is the truth any more than I am convinced that a Muslim "knows" his faith to be true, or a Shintoist /his/ faith, or whatever. I know a Wiccan who "knows" her faith is true just as thoroughly as you "know" yours is; obviously, at least one of you is simply wrong, regardless of the fervency of your belief. Second, the Bible has not been validated as thoroughly as you claim. The book of Esther, for example, is historical fiction pure and simple; absolutely none of the eventsa described in that book has any basis in any known history or any correlation to any other historical work whatsoever. I also find it highly suspicious that there is no Egyptian historical record /anywhere/ of any of the plagues or catastrophes visited upon that populance by a righteous God to persuade the pharoh to leave Moses alone; for that matter, there isn't even a record of any massive exodus of Hebrews on the scale described by the Bible. I generally view Christianity on about the same level I do most other organized religions: it contains some interesting ideas, a general knowledge of it is necessary if one wants to understand history; but as a system of beliefs explaining why the Universe is the way it is I think it has about as much validity as astrology, Islam, or dianetics. I am interently distrustful of totally self-referential and arbitrary belief systems, and I have yet to see a single argument put forth by anyone that will give me any basis whatsoever for believing that Christianity is any different from any other faith. I am also unimpressed with Christianity's track record so far--it has been responsible for more wars than I have fingers and toes, the destruction of the library at Alexandria and several major civilizations, and a great deal of misery and human suffering, in the name of what? =========== From: TURTLE To: CHIP P. UNICORN Subject: Version # Date & Time: 05/07/90 01:05:39 Message Number 4277 Why, thank you. 3.00 still has a few weird quirky misfeatures, but such is life...mine at least. =========== From: TURTLE To: CHIP P. UNICORN Subject: Foo Date & Time: 05/07/90 01:08:09 Message Number 4278 >You, who worship the samee God who slew forty-two youths when they >called Elisha "baldy"? Chip, that's beautiful. We need more Christians like you--most born- agains I know are even more obnoxious the second time around. =========== From: TURTLE To: CHIP P. UNICORN Subject: Real faith Date & Time: 05/07/90 01:10:40 Message Number 4279 ANY religious structure requires a great deal of faith to believe in, simply because all religions are inherently self-referential and by their very nature cannot be proven or disproven. Son-worship may be more sophisticated than sun-worship, but in the end their adherents do not subscribe to them for any rational reason at all. As for people who KNOW (all capital letters) that Christianity is correct: For any Belief System X, you will find people who KNOW beyond a shadow of a doubt that Belief System X is absolutely true. The fact that these belief systems are fundamentally incompatible does not seem to change the mind-sets or the attitudes of their adherents. --An ex-fundamentalist Turtle =========== From: TURTLE To: CHIP P. UNICORN Subject: What I'm doing. Date & Time: 05/07/90 01:14:34 Message Number 4280 >Anyone got a suggestion? Not any that are likely to be helpful. Myself, I'd say order a pizza and forget about it, but you'd likely take that as being sarcastic, which it isn't. If there is a god, then he/she/it hasn't seen fit to provide humanity with any convincing reason to believe in him/her/it; therefore, it's kind of a moot argument. Eat a pizza; the rest will sort itself out. If this particular diety sees fit to damn people who take that attitude, after not providing any reason /not/ to--well, is that entity really worthy of worship to begin with? --An agnostic Turtle =========== From: CORWYN OF AMBER To: JONBOY Subject: Real dips Date & Time: 05/07/90 02:33:31 Message Number 4281 I don't claim to know whether or not there is a god (or God if you prefer capitalization) that's what agnosic means. I /am/ certain however that I would not wish to worship the God described in the bible. It is not a book which I know particularly well, I don't feel it gains any significance by being very old yet still believed by many. Galileo came up against blind faith in his conflict with the catholic church in the early 1600's. He contended by observing the way shadows were cast across the moon, that it was not the "perfect celestial sphere" which the church claimed all heavenly bodies were. When he supplemented his hypothesis with data obtained from his telescope (which was actually not invented by Galileo, but by Hans Lipperhay) He was accused of creating and using "tools of the devil" - Niccolo Lorini. I claim no certainty, and try to judge things as logically and coherently as possible. I will not deny the existence of a God, I simply see no point in worshipping one if it exists. This is not arrogance, simply the full use of the judgement which if a God created me, he must have given me. I will live my life by my own counsel, not by the instructions of an old book. I would like to read the Bible through sometime.. and I undoubtedly could learn something from it, however I will always trust my own judgement above that of any organization or doctrine. Mine is not a middle of the road stance.. it is simply pragmatic. - Corwyn =========== From: CORWYN OF AMBER To: KEN OBER Subject: You Dweeb... Date & Time: 05/07/90 02:55:34 Message Number 4282 286 - 1950.. I think you're a little confused on dates Ken.. - Corwyn =========== From: CORWYN OF AMBER To: CHIP P. UNICORN Subject: Real solutions Date & Time: 05/07/90 02:57:29 Message Number 4283 You have sacrificed simply to give them the word of god.. He loves you you know! He died for you.. the lord is all forgiving.. just give me your money and you'll get into heaven for sure! - Corwyn =========== From: CORWYN OF AMBER To: TURTLE Subject: Real weird Date & Time: 05/07/90 03:04:44 Message Number 4284 The Church of the Everlasting Green Shell (May Forever Be it Hard) ?? Has a ring to it.. think we could get a spot right after 700 club? That Decstation is looking affordable. - Corwyn =========== From: CORWYN OF AMBER To: TURTLE Subject: Real People Date & Time: 05/07/90 03:07:32 Message Number 4285 Well.. I might be his sex slave for a little while.. but it would be a strictly mercenary arrangement.. I get his 'old' computers. - Corwyn =========== From: CORWYN OF AMBER To: TURTLE Subject: Real faith Date & Time: 05/07/90 03:13:30 Message Number 4286 I KNOW getting up in the morning is EVIL!!! (A lifetime of experience) hmmm.. getting up in the morning as Satan.. we mave have a sensible foundation for Christianity here after all. - Corwyn =========== From: CORWYN OF AMBER To: TURTLE Subject: What I'm doing. Date & Time: 05/07/90 03:15:22 Message Number 4287 Pizza isn't proof of god?? Sacriligous Heretic Scum!!! - Corwyn (Garcia's pizza = Nirvana) =========== From: CORWYN OF AMBER To: ALL YOU! Subject: Hey.. Date & Time: 05/07/90 03:17:48 Message Number 4288 This place is great.. but I'm going to whine about my board now.. I'm starting to cry as I look at my message areas.. really.. if you try, they /could/ be good! So call.. write something blasphemous, and enjoy.. The Shadow BBS @ (813) 359-1717 (Echo's probably won't be a reality until next year... but can't we make enough noise ourselves? ) - Corwyn (The lonely Sysop) =========== From: C.C.A. To: DONTHEN Subject: Real solutions Date & Time: 05/07/90 13:14:27 Message Number 4289 No, that is not what I meant. I meant: If a person can believe that taking life is right, they should be equally acceptant of the chance of infinitely prolonging it. But, in accepting the latter half, a person should see how wrong the former is. =========== From: C.C.A. To: CHIP P. UNICORN Subject: Foo Date & Time: 05/07/90 13:34:03 Message Number 4290 I believe in the God of the bible. Some people know him better as YAWEH or JEHOVA. I believe in the God that ransomed MY soul from HELL. My God has already given me joy. My God can also be your God, if YOU already know My God, then you'll understand that I don't need to: >Watch /MY/ diety. Because HE watches over ME. =========== From: C.C.A. To: CHIP P. UNICORN Subject: Real dips Date & Time: 05/07/90 13:42:42 Message Number 4291 Without FAITH noone could live in this whreched world. =========== From: C.C.A. To: TURTLE Subject: Real weird Date & Time: 05/07/90 13:46:59 Message Number 4292 I think you know what I meant. =========== From: TURTLE To: CORWYN OF AMBER Subject: 286: Stone Age Date & Time: 05/07/90 15:38:34 Message Number 4293 I think Ken's confused, too: the only commonly available calculating devices in 1950 were abacuses, which are generally /much/ more sophisticated than 80286 machines. =========== From: TURTLE To: CORWYN OF AMBER Subject: Pizza=God Date & Time: 05/07/90 15:41:00 Message Number 4294 >Pizza isn't proof of God? Sacriligious Heretic Scum!!! That's "Blasphemous Sacriligious Heretic Scum" to you, mister. /Everybody/ (except you, evidently) knows that pizza isn't proof of God; Z-System is. --A blasphemous sacriligious heretic Turtle =========== From: TURTLE To: C.C.A. Subject: Bar Date & Time: 05/07/90 15:44:28 Message Number 4295 >I believe in the God of the bible. Why? >My God can also be your God... Again, why? =========== From: TURTLE To: C.C.A. Subject: Real dips Date & Time: 05/07/90 15:45:13 Message Number 4296 >Without FAITH noone could live in this whreched [sic] world. Really? What makes you say that? I know for a fact that that statement simply isn't true. =========== From: TURTLE To: +ALL+ Subject: This area Date & Time: 05/07/90 15:46:13 Message Number 4297 You will no doubt have noticed a new conference in the list by now: Z-SIG (this very conference, in fact). The purpose of this message area is to provide support for all the users out there (and there seem to be a surprising number of them) running Z-System and CP/M-80. This conference will act as an area to exchange information pertaining to Z-System and CP/M, and provide support and advice for Z and CP/M users. Is simple, yes? --A Z Turtle =========== From: DONTHEN To: C.C.A. Subject: Real solutions Date & Time: 05/07/90 16:14:12 Message Number 4298 > If a person can believe that taking life is right, they should be > equally aceptant of the chance of infinitely prolonging it. Hm. Sorry, still don't see a connection between these. If any connection could be made, I would expect it to be closer to the opposite; Christianity (about the only religion I can think of offhand that teaches of an afterlife in a way that could be considered an "infinite extension" of one's self/soul) professes to teach respect for human life, which is, presumably, why many Christians are against abortion in the first place--they believe that the ends do not justify the means, regardless of the mother's wishes or extenuating circumstance of the pregnancy. On the other hand, I expect people who truly believe that taking life is "right"--which is a tough case to support, as almost anyone (Christian or otherwise) will be forced to concede that killing is not always a black-and-white issue, even if it is something to be avoided if at all possible--really don't think much about eternity at all. =========== From: DONTHEN To: TURTLE Subject: Bar Date & Time: 05/07/90 16:21:04 Message Number 4299 > My God can also be your God... so, "wouldncha like ta be a Pepper, too?" =========== From: DONTHEN To: TURTLE Subject: This area Date & Time: 05/07/90 16:22:44 Message Number 4300 Z-System? Is that for DOS machines?.... =========== From: CHIP P. UNICORN To: TURTLE Subject: Xnty... Date & Time: 05/07/90 17:08:35 Message Number 4301 Hmmm... just curious. What are your sources to say that there was no historical record in Egypt of the (presumed) plagues? Do we still have ALL of the records of the ancient pharaohs? Proving or disproving something through history, especially ancient history, is tough. But -- I wouldn't call Christianity the most warlike religion. Probably Islam is more so, among the major religions. (What the first sentence of this paragraph has to do with the second one is beyond me.) I would not call Christianity totally self-referential, or arbitrary. It filled a need during the Roman times, giving people hope of an afterlife, and has since evolved, filling that need for over a billion people. But -- be kind to the Christians. Though many people have died in the name of Christ, many great works and deeds were also done in His name. Most great works in Europe for the past fifteen hundred years were done in His name. Same with the colonization of the Americas. So... nyaaah! Chip P. Unicorn =========== From: CHIP P. UNICORN To: TURTLE Subject: Foo Date & Time: 05/07/90 17:14:58 Message Number 4302 It's kinda like Vlad's description of his religion: "I worship an obscure war-god." Chip P. Unicorn =========== From: CHIP P. UNICORN To: TURTLE Subject: What I'm doing. Date & Time: 05/07/90 17:17:13 Message Number 4303 Of course most born-again Christians would start yelling the teleological argument at you ("Take a look at the order in the universe! Order has to come from somewhere, right? Doesn't that just PROVE that there's a Deity Somewhere Out There?" And blathering on and on...) Then again, most born-again Christians don't see the problems with the statement: "The Trinitarian believes God is Triunity. That is a belief gleaned from the Bible. Therefore, he also believes the Bible to be true." (This was an ACTUAL example of so-called "good logic" from a book I own.) Class, can we find TWO mistakes in the above logic? The problems with any proof that God exists is that we really have no unquestionable assumtions to work with -- and any such proof can be twisted to say that, say, gryphons exist. The basic belief in God is itself an assumption. Okay: why believe in Him? The best response I've ever seen was Pascal's: Think of the consequences. Even if the chances are one in a million that God exists, it's better to believe in Him. Here's why: There are four possibilities: a) God doesn't exist, and you don't believe in Him: Fine. No problem. No one will toss you in His non-existant torture chamber. b) God doesn't exist, and you believe in Him: Well, you might be a bit disappointed when you're reincarnated, but -- heck -- it's better than toast. c) God does exist, and you believe in Him: Welcome to Abraham's bosom, buddy. The best possible situation for the afterlife. d) God does exist, and you don't believe in Him: Toast. You have no control over whether or not God exists... heck; you don't even know whether or not He exists. But -- in game-theory terms, which is it better to do: believe, or not believe? The only fault in this idea: in WHICH god do you believe? Chip P. Unicorn =========== From: CHIP P. UNICORN To: CORWYN OF AMBER Subject: Real solutions Date & Time: 05/07/90 17:29:07 Message Number 4304 Corwyn, Just thinking: isn't there a remarkable similarity between modern televangelists and the medieval clergy who sold indulgances? Chip P. Unicorn =========== From: CHIP P. UNICORN To: C.C.A. Subject: Real solutions Date & Time: 05/07/90 17:30:58 Message Number 4305 C.C.A., A Bible verse FOR Abortion: "And I declared that the dead, who had already died, are happier than the living, who are still alive. But better than both is he who has not yet been, who has not seen the evil that is done under the sun." -- Ecclesiastes 4:2-3 =========== From: CHIP P. UNICORN To: C.C.A. Subject: Real dips Date & Time: 05/07/90 17:37:02 Message Number 4306 >Without faith no one could live in this wretched world. Which your God created? If God is all-powerful, why is there suffering in the world? If evil is so abhorrent to your God, why does He allow it? If He created this wretched world, why did He not give to everyone an "inner sense" that He exists -- as proof of His existance? Chip P. Unicorn =========== From: ACAPULCO To: TURTLE Subject: What I'm doing. Date & Time: 05/07/90 19:42:09 Message Number 4309 A thought occurs to me (how rare!). IF God was to provide us with unshakable proof of His existence, who's to say that proof will remain after a few hundred years? For example, please assume Jesus _did_ rise after His crucifixion (sp?). Yes, that would be a strong miracle, as it is told in the Bible. Those witnessing the event would be quite convinced. Technology as it was, before long folks would _have_ to rely on faith, since there was no other reliable form of recording history. Now, extrapolate that to today. Were such an event to occur, the witnesses would once again be convinced. Word would spread faster, and the event might even be recorded in a more reliable manner, but who is to say such evidence (verbal & otherwise) would last another 1000 - 2000 years? I can understand skepticism, but only when viewed with an open mind. Just as religion requires strong faith, so should skeptics be required to accept the _chance_ they might be wrong. I, too, am "born-again" and am not pushy about the subject. My religion is between me & my God. What irks me are those folks who either insist their way is the right way, without any rational discussion, or who insist there is no right way, without allowing for the possibility that not everything _can_ be rationally explained. (Stepping off soap box) {Acapulco} =========== From: KILLASHANDRA REE To: JONBOY Subject: Real dips Date & Time: 05/08/90 00:01:08 Message Number 4311 Very interesting. You conclude your message with "read with an open mind" (in reference to the Bible), yet at the beginning you state that you know conclusively that God exists. Further, the God you know exists is the Christian God, i.e., the one depicted in the Bible. : Leaving aside any questions of whether or not everyone would arrive at the same concept of "God" by looking through the Bible, this strikes me as a dismayingly arrogant statement. It reminds me of a less well-thought-out version of a C.S. Lewis parable, wherein he makes the claim that all belief systems (except Christianity, of course) are analagous to different pairs of spectacles through which one can view the truth. Different pairs of glasses highlight and distort different things, but they are all pointing in the right direction--some are just clearer than others. Lewis, of course, believed as you evidently do, that Christianity is the "Light" that people were viewing through these glasses. What both of you so blithely dismiss is the very real, and perhaps most likely, possibility that Christianity is simply another pair of spectacles. : : Killashandra =========== From: KILLASHANDRA REE To: CHIP P. UNICORN Subject: What I'm doing. Date & Time: 05/08/90 00:14:37 Message Number 4312 : One other qestion that raises. Do "game-theory terms" provide a sufficient rationale for subscribing to any belief system at all, much less one over another? If "God" exists and a person does not believe in her, this is only a problem if "God" is as jealous and unforgiving as portrayed in most of Christianity. Somehow it seems foolish to believe that an omnipotent, omniscient and at least partially benevolent being would be that outraged at a mortal's disbelief in her. : : Killashandra =========== From: TURTLE To: CHIP P. UNICORN Subject: Xnty... Date & Time: 05/08/90 00:26:10 Message Number 4313 I was not trying to imply that the lack of record of the Biblical plagues proves that they never happened, although I do find it highly suspicious that a large number of Egyptian records have survived from that time and not one of them so much as mentions anything of the sort described in Exodus. What I was doing is pointing out that the historical record does not validate the events described in the Bible to the degree that some people seem to think that it does. Islam is, in fact, more warlike than Christianity--but interestingly enough, it is also (as a general rule) more likely to embrace science than is Christianity. While the Roman Catholic Church was busy condemning Galileo as a heretic, the Muslim upper class of the Persian Empire was busy supporting the sciences, specifically astronomy, medicine, and mathematics, to such a large degree that /all/ the greatest accomplishments in that field during the Middle Ages occurred in Islamic areas of the world. (Of course,m the Catholic Church is hard at work even now to rectify that situation; why, in 1972 they even went so far as to acquit Galileo of wrongdoing regarding his claim that the moon was not a perfect celestial body...) Sure, Christianity on the whole is responsible for a great deal of good; but is the price really worth it? Is it really that unreasonable to ask for a religion that teaches us to respect one another without the "everyone else is damned" element that causes us to abuse one another? =========== From: TURTLE To: CHIP P. UNICORN Subject: What I'm doing. Date & Time: 05/08/90 00:35:21 Message Number 4314 I'm fairly pleased with myself; I independantly came up with Pascal's payoff matrix for religious faith when I was about 14 years old and still trying to decide if I really wanted to remain Fundamentalist. Problem is, the matrix is too simple. Consider this: God exists, you don't believe in Him, toast. God exists, you believe in the /wrong one/, God is insecure about that sort of thing: McHistory. You've just bought yourself a ticket to the special areas of Hell most ordinary sinners don't get to see...This sort of thing can be manipulated forever if you're into game theory and need the excercise, but it's not worth much as a serious argument to take up the cross. =========== From: TURTLE To: KILLASHANDRA REE Subject: What who's doin Date & Time: 05/08/90 00:42:31 Message Number 4315 >Somehow it seems foolish to believe that an omnipotent, omniscent >and at least partially benevolent being would be that outraged at >a mortals disbelief in her. Particularly when she hasn't seen fit to give that particular individual any /reason/ to believe in her in the first place. =========== From: YNGLING To: CHIP P. UNICORN Subject: please... Date & Time: 05/08/90 15:33:07 Message Number 4317 Chip, C'mon, tell this story about destroying the church in Mexico. I've /got/ to hear this. The Yngling =========== From: YNGLING To: ANGEL Subject: New crusade Date & Time: 05/08/90 15:43:54 Message Number 4318 Angel, Dont worry dear, with attitudes like yours being the rule rather than the exception, soon the earth /will/ be a barren rock devoid of life and moisture and so there wont be a need for a "moon day" since we'll have our very own version right here where we can die on it! Pass me a bottle of air, will ya? The Yngling =========== From: YNGLING To: C.C.A. Subject: Real dips Date & Time: 05/08/90 15:56:09 Message Number 4319 Why on earth do you make the assumption that everybody worships "SOME- THING?" I would be curious to hear you defend that statement (unless your only defense is some pablum thats been spoon fed to you in your Sunday school classes). The Yngling =========== From: YNGLING To: JONBOY Subject: Real dips Date & Time: 05/08/90 16:01:38 Message Number 4320 Jonboy, If there is a god who claims to be a just and loving god but whom not only desires but /recquires/ the saccharine adulation of his creations and considers eternal punishment without parole or pardon a just sentence for failure to obey his every whim...then I for one want no part of him/her/it. The Yngling =========== From: YNGLING To: CHIP P. UNICORN Subject: game-theory Date & Time: 05/08/90 16:16:55 Message Number 4321 Chip, So, I should believe in god, even if I /really/ dont, just in case? But then, if he exists, wouldnt he know Im only faking it? Your argument is logical, but in reality doesnt work if god really does exist. Basically, it sounds like you are promoting hypocrisy (but I know youre not). The Yngling =========== From: CORWYN OF AMBER To: C.C.A. Subject: Real dips Date & Time: 05/08/90 19:44:51 Message Number 4323 I have no, or very little faith.. but I don't find the world so wretched do you think there could be a connection? - Corwyn =========== From: CORWYN OF AMBER To: TURTLE Subject: 286: Stone Age Date & Time: 05/08/90 19:45:48 Message Number 4324 Tell me it again when you're running real bbs software.. although of course, I'm running real software and have dead message bases.. so I guess I should shut up. - Corwyn =========== From: CORWYN OF AMBER To: TURTLE Subject: Pizza=God Date & Time: 05/08/90 19:47:02 Message Number 4325 Z-system is proof of hackers.. hackers are the spawn of God, (and of course the most favoured children of God)however maybe they are god, and maybe I'm confused.. I shouldn't be up when it's still light out.. does weird things to my brain. - Corwyn =========== From: CORWYN OF AMBER To: TURTLE Subject: Bar Date & Time: 05/08/90 19:49:10 Message Number 4326 No.. you can't have him.. He's ALL MINE.. I kidnapped him from an old folks home about three months ago, He's hiding in the corner, under my bed.. (he's pretty small for a god) - Corwyn =========== From: CORWYN OF AMBER To: DONTHEN Subject: This area Date & Time: 05/08/90 19:51:52 Message Number 4327 Does it run on DOS, or is an addition to OS/2? OS/2 is wonderful, OS/2 is your friend.. Microsoft is your friend.. everybody should run DOS and OS/2 dual boot machines, everyone who doesn't are traitors. - Corwyn =========== From: CORWYN OF AMBER To: CHIP P. UNICORN Subject: What I'm doing. Date & Time: 05/08/90 19:56:15 Message Number 4328 Also.. what if God doesn't want to be believed in, he might be very upset with people who beleive in him, say prayers to him, but some bigmouth (Jesus) blabbed and got everybody bothering the big guy? How happy is he going to be with folks that kept pestering him? e) beleive in god, and he doesn't want you to: Crispy Crittur. Just saying that "which god?" is not the only hole in his argument.. there are more. - Corwyn =========== From: CORWYN OF AMBER To: CHIP P. UNICORN Subject: Real solutions Date & Time: 05/08/90 20:00:40 Message Number 4329 Yeah.. and money grubbing bastard everywhere-and-when will come up with similar schemes for power of poor schmucks who believe them. - Corwyn =========== From: CORWYN OF AMBER To: ACAPULCO Subject: What I'm doing. Date & Time: 05/08/90 20:03:59 Message Number 4330 Good point.. but Robert A. Heinlen's "Stranger in a Strange Land" could also show up in about 2000 years, and start a new religous movement.. who would be able to say that Mike /didn't/ actually fly? - Corwyn =========== From: BLACK MAGIC To: RAVEN Subject: Gee..... Date & Time: 05/08/90 20:32:54 Message Number 4331 Hi again! Thanx, I'll need plenty of luck...Turtle's on his way to my place to work on the program w/ me now....so, how's life? :) The Lady =========== From: BLACK MAGIC To: RAVEN Subject: sleeping and >< Date & Time: 05/08/90 20:34:00 Message Number 4332 Still waiting for a reply! =========== From: BLACK MAGIC To: YNGLING Subject: :) Date & Time: 05/08/90 20:37:29 Message Number 4333 Dearest Yngling, I do miss you, too! I'm living and I hope your case is coming along in your favor! Drop me a line sometime.... The Lady =========== From: BLACK MAGIC To: BIG BLACK DUDE Subject: Black is Back Date & Time: 05/08/90 20:40:19 Message Number 4334 Shall I pass? The Lady In Black =========== From: BLACK MAGIC To: BEATLE Subject: song Date & Time: 05/08/90 20:40:51 Message Number 4335 NOPE! :> =========== From: BLACK MAGIC To: SNAKEBYTE Subject: ummmmmm Date & Time: 05/08/90 20:42:31 Message Number 4336 :> =========== From: BLACK MAGIC To: JONBOY Subject: Hugo's there? Date & Time: 05/08/90 20:46:00 Message Number 4337 Sounds cool to me...:) The Lady =========== From: BLACK MAGIC To: BEATLE Subject: God... Date & Time: 05/08/90 20:49:54 Message Number 4338 PRO-CHOICE!!!!!! Ghods, teenagers don't belong giving birth to babies, but then again....they shouldn't be getting pregnant in the first place! PRO-CHOICE because it's a woman's right.... =========== From: TURTLE To: CORWYN OF AMBER Subject: Real dips Date & Time: 05/08/90 21:57:14 Message Number 4342 The connection is obvious, dude: if you base your life around a constant struggle to make it into heaven, the real world will look pretty bad. Personally, I wonder if it might not be a better idea to expend your resources trying to make the world around you better than waiting for everything to get all better all by itself when you die. ("Once you're past the graveyard, nothing can go wrong...") --A dedicated Turtle =========== From: TURTLE To: CORWYN OF AMBER Subject: 286: Stone Age Date & Time: 05/08/90 22:00:06 Message Number 4343 I AM running real BBS software. Real /bad/ BBS software. Of course, I don't think my attitudes toward 286 machines would change if I switched to TBBS... =========== From: KEN OBER To: ALL Subject: HEHHEHE! Date & Time: 05/08/90 22:18:36 Message Number 4345 WEEEEEEEEEEEEEE'RRRRRRRRREEEEEEEEE BBBBBBBBBAAAAAAAACCCCCCCCKKKKK! (In theory, ya....) THE \A/B/R/A/C/A/D/A/B/R/A/ BBS!!!! \A/B/R/A/C/A/D/A/B/R/ \A/B/R/A/C/A/D/A/B/ \A/B/R/A/C/A/D/A/ \A/B/R/A/C/A/D/ \A/B/R/A/C/A/ \A/B/R/A/C/ \A/B/R/A/ \A/B/R/ \A/B/ \A/ ^ SysOp: Tyler Robinson Number: 813/378-2218 Settings: 8-N-1-1200 Modes: ASCII Hey, we used to be Remote Control! but now we are better! Please understand that this setup isn't /great/....It is just temp- orary until the HD and BBS software is purchased (In the next few weeks).....We /should/ be running Paragon by the end on the month... ANyways, please add us back to your autodial list, and call back ASAP! We support 300/1200 Baud 24 Hours a day! HANDLES ARE ALLOWED! When Paragon arrives, people who want access to the non-handle FIDO echoes will have to have two accounts! (One for real name (to accomidate FIDO), and one for a handle (To accomidate local messages and/or handle FIDOS).) CALL ASAP! -Ken Ober- =========== From: DONTHEN To: CORWYN OF AMBER Subject: This area Date & Time: 05/08/90 23:54:55 Message Number 4346 Yes, that's it. How silly of me. Z-System is an add-on for OS/2. I think it requires Presentation Manager, too, doesn't it? =========== From: DONTHEN To: KEN OBER Subject: HEHHEHE! Date & Time: 05/08/90 23:56:47 Message Number 4347 The name of your system didn't appear in that message. Was it in ANSI or Amiga graphics or something else unuseful like that? =========== From: SNAKEBYTE To: CORWYN OF AMBER Subject: -=*><*=- Date & Time: 05/09/90 00:48:48 Message Number 4349 hmmmmm.....I wonder if that 'Coyote syndrome' has anything to do with the fact that I have no arms. OOOOOps.....for got, snakes don't got no arms......whew, thought I'd missed something.....BADDDDDD. =========== From: SNAKEBYTE To: DM2 Subject: -=*><*=- Date & Time: 05/09/90 00:51:15 Message Number 4350 I've got a whole pack of photo's of me in college that would probably get me arrested in most states, locked in a pack in a fire proof-locked safety box hidden in the house (away from th ol' lady). The bitch about it is that I DIDN'T TAKE THEM...AND I HAVE NO IDEA WHERE THE NEGATIVES ARE!!! There's only about (hmmmm...how many photos in a stack 2-1/2" high)....oh well....life's lil' mysteries. ===========