From: YNGLING To: TURTLE Subject: Arrghhh Date & Time: 05/13/90 22:09:20 Message Number 4551 Turtle, I never thought Id say this, but, this latest message chain with Mr/Miss C.C.A. re: religion has made me long for those wonderful discussions about abortion we were having a while back. Can anyone, other than Chip, discuss the pro-Christianity side without falling back on the pablum-dogma crap they were spoon-fed as children in Sunday school? The Yngling (who has apparently been serving Satan for many moons without being aware of it - damn, I hate it when that happens!) =========== From: DONTHEN To: DELPHI Subject: godtalk Date & Time: 05/13/90 23:07:02 Message Number 4552 "Desert nomads" are hunter/gatherers and tribal. Agriculture comes later up the "chain" of social development than H-G societies do; saying "goddess times were gathers and argricultural and tribal" is a little confusing. Nevertheless, I haven't read the book you refer to but if the author is making the black/white distinction you paint, she's being awfully simplistic. Christianity came from an area that was /never/ peaceful; there is no evidence I am aware of that the Middle East ever supported the suspiciously utopic matriarchal society a lot of feminist theologians believe existed before (patriarchal) Judaism moved in. Your (or her) thesis works when you talk of Christianity coming into the areas where Wicca was the predominant religion; Wicca is certainly a lot less violent than Christianity is, and could be considered matriarchal in a lot of ways. However, anthropologist Margaret Murray's THE GOD OF THE WITCHES makes the assertion--with a fair amount of stuff backing her up--that the first known religion, which evolved into Wicca, was the Cult of the Horned God. The goddess aspect of the religion was added later, and didn't rise to ascendency over (in many varients eliminate) the male aspect until after Christianity--not Judiasm--began to threaten it. It would seem that if you are going to anthropomorphize your deities at all, you should have both a male and a female. If patriarchal systems can lead to skewed worldviews, and there's a lot of evidence to support that claim, that absolutely does /not/ mean that matriarchal systems /cannot/. =========== From: DONTHEN To: C.C.A. Subject: Real dips Date & Time: 05/13/90 23:21:23 Message Number 4553 You, sir, are working very hard at proving yourself a twit. You haven't read half of the messages to you, including some you really SHOULD read to you from Chip P. Unicorn, but at least you're responding to enough of them to tell us all that we're going to burn in hell because we don't believe the same way you do. Hell yourself, man, no matter what you believe I can guarantee 80% of the other Christians in the world would find things to disagree with you on. And do you really think a God of Love deserving of the name would condemn everybody who didn't believe just the way your church's pastor taught the Bible to eternal damnation, much less all the people in the world who will live their entire lives--quite happily--without ever having heard of Christ? We can forgive some of your brashness because of your age, but there are people on this board no older than you who are already using their brains, proving it is indeed possible. Why don't you join them? Honestly, sir, get a life. =========== From: DONTHEN To: SAURON Subject: They hate... Date & Time: 05/13/90 23:27:17 Message Number 4554 > How many sins have the Polynesians committed? Five hundred and fourteen. =========== From: BLACK MAGIC To: DONTHEN Subject: ::sigh:: Date & Time: 05/13/90 23:49:32 Message Number 4556 Supposed to be addressed to DM2....Qmodem isn't half bad, either....if you'd like a copy.... The Lady =========== From: CORWYN OF AMBER To: TURTLE Subject: New new subject Date & Time: 05/14/90 01:40:32 Message Number 4557 True, but 90% of the poeple who I know that have a terminal program, (or terminal) that has cursor positioning codes, are VT100 compatible. I /still/ want to know what uses avatar! I'm considering implementing it on my bbs, and would really like to know what it's native to, so I can find out a little more about it. I could do some of it just from Telix's AVATAR.KEY file, but I'd really like to have a tech document on it. - Corwyn =========== From: CORWYN OF AMBER To: BLACK MAGIC Subject: ::sigh:: Date & Time: 05/14/90 01:54:31 Message Number 4558 Do yourself a favor, trash Qmodem, get Telix. Ask Chip, ask Raven, Qmodem bites rocks. I'd say it comes close to Telemate for disgusting mis-management of ram. Telemate takes more RAM, (It like about 1 Meg of expanded, in /addtion/ to all your conventional, but at least it does stuff neither Telix or Qmodem do. Qmodem takes twice the ram, and has half the features of telix. -- OK. so I lied Qmodem has a full color scroll back buffer, wow! Why do I get so upset about this, I don't know, I guess some of Turtle rabid hatred of bloated code has rubbed off on me I don't hate all MS-DOS programs (or even most of them) but when one is amazingly inefficient, it bothers me. Telix's script language is also a lot better, (It's basically a modified "C") and I can give you a log-on script for this BBS, and one that will work for BBSX (suncoast city) Remote Access (TCB & others) QuickBBS (Mine & others) and Opus.. (You've /got/ to know what Opus is) you can get the newest version-3.12 from my board.. - Corwyn =========== From: ANGEL To: RUFUS Subject: New crusade Date & Time: 05/14/90 02:34:16 Message Number 4559 > Peopl've told me I have cute rear parts... The front parts ain't too shabby as well. =========== From: ANGEL To: SAURON Subject: dirt, she says? Date & Time: 05/14/90 02:38:34 Message Number 4560 No thanks, I already had kinky plans for the weekend. Assisted at my parents' garage sale, can't get much kinkier than that. They got rid of tons of stuff, made nice money, and the only two things I brought to sell got stolen. Now, stealing from a garage sale is lower then low. That's below being pond scum. (Espcially since I really wasn't sure I wanted to sell my electronic thesaurus, but would have gladly parted with it for the HIGH price I was asking ... by no means did I wish to give it away! He also lifted a still-factory-sealed dictionary for word-processing. I see why computer hackers get a bad rep!) That's my kvetching for the day. Hope your weekend was happier. =========== From: ANGEL To: JONBOY Subject: validation Date & Time: 05/14/90 02:52:54 Message Number 4561 I'm not sure what point you are trying to make when you claim the Bible has sustained a 2000 year test. One, most verifications of the historical accuracy of the Bible deal with the Old Testament, which is much older than 2000 years. Second, there is substantial verification for the Illiad and the Oddysey, giving strong indication that the events chronicled is historically accurate. Does this mean that the many gods described in the literature existed as well? You would say, of course not, for many valid reasons ... the same reasons that non-Christians would give for not accepting YOUR beliefs. But all this misses the point. As you said in your post, the Bible is "literature". It was never intended to be a book of science, or history, or math, or astronomy, etc. It is a book of faith, and must be accepted on that level. Any arguements for or against the Bible on the basis of anything but faith are doomed to fail. =========== From: ANGEL To: C.C.A. Subject: Real dips Date & Time: 05/14/90 03:10:57 Message Number 4562 > Without FAITH noone could live in the whreched world. Nice theory, but severly flawed. As you can tell from reading the posts on this board, apparently there are many who live without your capitalized FAITH and do it quite nicely. You have any other false platitudes? =========== From: ANGEL To: ACAPULCO Subject: What I'm doing. Date & Time: 05/14/90 03:18:36 Message Number 4563 Ooh, ooh, yes! Nice concept about the verifications not standing up through time ... there's a neat short story in there. =========== From: DM2 To: BLACK MAGIC Subject: QModem Date & Time: 05/14/90 03:50:47 Message Number 4564 I'll keep that in mind... :) I've *finally* gotten the xmodem working to my satisfaction. Now... what to upload, what to upload? -----DM2 =========== From: DM2 To: CORWYN OF AMBER Subject: ::sigh:: Date & Time: 05/14/90 03:52:54 Message Number 4565 Ya know, I'm eventually gonna figure out what y'all are talking about... ;) =========== From: BLACK MAGIC To: CHIP P. UNICORN Subject: Xnty... Date & Time: 05/14/90 16:46:39 Message Number 4567 Funny, Religion is frustrating in that way...You are really believing in something that cannot be totally justified. I don't think even MY Rabbi could argue that one....no religion can be totally justified. I /personally/ have never SEEN G-d, or heard G-d, but still I am asked to believe in G-d. Why? How? I find that discussion on Religion is very interesting and also very confusing. No two people believe exactly the same thing without questioning it any point in their lives, can you argue that? I don't think anyone could. I think the train of discussion on the board is interesting, but still it seems 'attacking' in a sense. Why not just ask questions and hope, or get, replies? Certain subjects are touchy....Religion for one. I only hate talking about them when people impose their views on me...or rather, when they preach at me and tell me what to believe. I have a mind, one that some say G-d gave me, so why not let me use it? The Lady =========== From: BLACK MAGIC To: TURTLE Subject: IBMs Date & Time: 05/14/90 16:57:01 Message Number 4568 Nice attitude! I always did love that about you! :> When did you get an IBM, anyway? And why? And..... -The Lady =========== From: BLACK MAGIC To: CORWYN OF AMBER Subject: ::sigh:: Date & Time: 05/14/90 17:02:24 Message Number 4569 Thanks, love! Sheesh! I own Telex, I just don't use it...Qmodem does what I need....and I know what OPUS is, too. :) I may be female, but that doesn't make me lacking in knowledge.... The Happy Lady =========== From: BLACK MAGIC To: DM2 Subject: QModem Date & Time: 05/14/90 17:05:17 Message Number 4570 :) Well, if you'd like, I'm sure someone could compile a list..... :> The Lady In Black =========== From: BLACK MAGIC To: CHIP P. UNICORN Subject: God... Date & Time: 05/14/90 17:08:53 Message Number 4571 You have a right to your opinion...what I meant was that it is a person's own choice...no one should decide for them. Yes? The Lady =========== From: BLACK MAGIC To: YNGLING Subject: :) the sequel Date & Time: 05/14/90 17:10:22 Message Number 4572 A Box Full Of Hell was what I, too was referring to! :) So, where are you now? The Lady =========== From: DONTHEN To: CORWYN OF AMBER Subject: New new subject Date & Time: 05/14/90 17:49:28 Message Number 4573 Avatar is another ANSI variant; as far as anyone's been able to determine, there's no effective difference between them. I've used Opus 1.1x BBS's (the only BBS software I've seen that does Avatar) with terminals in ANSI mode and lost absolutely nothing. It'd be nice if you could find the VT52 superset that Atari ST's use--or for that matter, just normal VT52 codes to begin with. No color, but they get all the basics (cursor movement, direct positioning, etc.) down with a few of the weirdos like delete/insert line, etc. and do most of them in half the number of bytes the VT100/ANSI counterparts are. Most terminal programs that do any emulation know VT52; for people calling at 2400 bps or below, it'd significantly speed up terminal I/O if they could use it with things like full-screen editors, etc. (And you could still use it with IBM graphics, I suppose, since they're not part of ANSI anyway, despite what the people who write Opus think. Assuming the people who write Opus think ANYTHING....) =========== From: ACAPULCO To: ANGEL Subject: What I'm doing. Date & Time: 05/14/90 20:17:18 Message Number 4575 There is, isn't there. Unfortunately, I'm already working on enough writing these days, so I can't write that one just now. Perhaps, if you do, you'll give me credit, or at least a dedication, for the inspiration. {Acapulco} =========== From: TURTLE To: YNGLING Subject: Arrghhh Date & Time: 05/14/90 20:53:41 Message Number 4578 Re: C.C.A--Damn, I know what you mean. Religious debates can be fun, but not when your opponent gets cut-rate discounts from mind readers. *Sigh* I never did get the "Cannon Fodder for Christ (tm)" thing. =========== From: TURTLE To: ANGEL Subject: dirt, she says? Date & Time: 05/14/90 21:00:39 Message Number 4579 >He also lifted a still-factory-sealed dictionery for word-processing. >I see why computer hackers get a bad rep! Bite your tongue /hard/, ma'am. I am a hacker. The man who dynamically reallocated your dictionery program was a thief. The two are not the same. (To assist you in making the distinction: Hackers are the ones who say things like "You know, I really hate when I have to manually move the bootstrap loader for my PDP from low core to high core" and thieves say things like "Hey man, wanna buy a cheap stereo?") --A hacker Turtle (and damn proud of it!) =========== From: TURTLE To: BLACK MAGIC Subject: IBMs Date & Time: 05/14/90 21:06:05 Message Number 4580 >When did you get an IBM, anyway? And why? Umm...right after that headline "HELL FREEZES OVER" appeared in the New York Times, because an Iranian terrorist told me he'd shoot me if I didn't? =========== From: CHIP P. UNICORN To: TURTLE Subject: Nusubject (tm) Date & Time: 05/14/90 21:13:24 Message Number 4581 Dear Turtle, Menus are fantastic for new people to the computer community to learn new software. They're fantastic in restaurants, too -- imagine having to go through a command parser to order your Big Mac! Chip P. Unicorn =========== From: CHIP P. UNICORN To: DELPHI Subject: godtalk Date & Time: 05/14/90 21:18:31 Message Number 4582 Dear Delphi, Being in the middle of exams right now (and having been kidnapped by Donthen over to aLTER rEALITY cENTRAL), I haven't had a chance to look at Mary Daly's idea of active Be-ing. Is life merely an active process? I'd say that -- clarifying my definition a bit -- the thing that distinguishes life from non-life is purpose. All life has a purpose for their actions. Rocks may move, but they have no reason to do so,. I sincerely doubt goddess religions prevented all violence from mankind, or (even if that was true) that the only reason for violence to begin was the advent of a male-dominated religion. To repeat what I said to Sauron, I find mere religion to be a simplistic reason for the world's problems. Quite possibly, economics might have been another reason: civilized (i.e. people living in cities in the Mesopotamian valley) people had a lot more food, better clothing, and (possibly) alcohol. The barbarians might have been trying to better themselves by taking from others. What are your views about ecology? Chip P. Unicorn =========== From: CHIP P. UNICORN To: ACAPULCO Subject: Real solutions Date & Time: 05/14/90 21:28:00 Message Number 4583 Uhhh.... I think you're missing the point. Was mankind created before or after plants? C.P.U. =========== From: CHIP P. UNICORN To: BEATLE Subject: Real dips Date & Time: 05/14/90 21:31:01 Message Number 4584 >As a matter of fact, I have an extreme "good" complex. Psychoanalysis can cure you of that. C.P.U. =========== From: CHIP P. UNICORN To: SAURON Subject: What I'm doing. Date & Time: 05/14/90 21:33:33 Message Number 4585 Dear Sauron, I do not object to your objection. I object only to your saying what I can or cannot write on a public board (not your own.) I don't feel I'm practicing evangelism surreptisiously... in fact, my own religious views are somewhat uncertain at the moment. I still believe the Bible as God's word -- but not in the same way that I used to. And I'm looking for as many viewpoints as possible to help me make up my mind. I apologize for using bombastic language before. C.P.U. =========== From: CHIP P. UNICORN To: SAURON Subject: They hate... Date & Time: 05/14/90 21:37:38 Message Number 4586 >How many sins have the Polynesians committed? In all honesty, I don't know. I haven't met, interviewed, and seen every waking moment of the lives of every Polynesian that has ever existed -- have you? Also, what point are you trying to make? C.P.U. =========== From: CHIP P. UNICORN To: JONBOY Subject: godtalk Date & Time: 05/14/90 21:40:42 Message Number 4587 In your message you said that Christianity and Islam are the same God. Really? How often do you read the Qu'ran? C.P.U. =========== From: CHIP P. UNICORN To: JONBOY Subject: godtalk Date & Time: 05/14/90 21:41:50 Message Number 4588 If it weren't for your headache, I'd ask you to explain your idea a bit more... How does participating in an ecosphere mean that something necessarily "lives"? Does the fact that a ray of starlight might interact with an ecosystem necessarily make it alive? C.P.U. =========== From: CHIP P. UNICORN To: DELPHI Subject: godtalk Date & Time: 05/14/90 21:51:04 Message Number 4589 >Only when we refuse to accept patriarchal concepts as truth or the >only reality... Ummmm... Delphi, here's another place where we completely disagree. Unfortunately, patriarchal concepts ARE a kind of truth: even granting all of your objections to them, civilizations have sprung up from them and have lasted for 4,000 years. They have served mankind for longer than almost any other ideology. This doesn't mean that they're the best for mankind -- only that they work for large groups, and that they've stood the test of time. Even if feminism worked for small groups, there's no guarantee they'll work with a planet of 5.5 billion people. Chip P. Unicorn =========== From: CHIP P. UNICORN To: BLACK MAGIC Subject: Xnty... Date & Time: 05/14/90 22:04:18 Message Number 4590 >You are really believing in something which cannot be totally >justified. You hit it right on, Black Magic. There's no proof of Adonai's existence, nor is there proof of non-existence. This is implicit in the definition: God exists where we cannot reach until we've died. Why not use your mind? That's exactly the method I've been trying to reach to find God -- or the non-existence of God. No luck so far -- but I find it more convenient to believe than not to. Chip P. Unicorn =========== From: CHIP P. UNICORN To: BLACK MAGIC Subject: God... Date & Time: 05/14/90 22:08:08 Message Number 4591 >No one should decide for them Right. =========== From: ANGEL To: ACAPULCO Subject: What I'm doing. Date & Time: 05/15/90 00:30:33 Message Number 4592 Sorry, you'll have to write that story yourself, I'm badly backlogged on ideas ... and depressingly mired in the middle of a story that refuses to find an end. Don't you just hate it when one of your creations simply refuses to die on cue? =========== From: SNAKEBYTE To: CORWYN OF AMBER Subject: -=*><*=- Date & Time: 05/15/90 01:31:56 Message Number 4593 It's a long story, but it's something that sorta comes and goes...that sensation of reptilian feelings usually hits early Saturday and Sunday mornings.....yuck!!!! =========== From: SNAKEBYTE To: CHIP P. UNICORN Subject: -=*><*=- Date & Time: 05/15/90 01:33:58 Message Number 4594 I would imagine most OTHER snakes, (and a few GIFTED women). By the way, the pornographic characteristics of the photos had nothing to do with WHY I would get in trouble for them. It is guilt by association.... =========== From: SNAKEBYTE To: RUFUS Subject: rOAD rALLY..... Date & Time: 05/15/90 01:36:08 Message Number 4595 >Use letters instead of numbers. I am kind of partial to numbers, ya know....9,10,11,18,13,14..... hehe, just kiddin'. Got to get something that can't be misunderstood. The last one I was on had pictures of pizzas on the bags and the clues were names of toppings.....I'll do something a little more imaginative next time too. AND COLLECT THE MONEY UP FRONT!!!!!! =========== From: SNAKEBYTE To: SAURON Subject: thermodynamics Date & Time: 05/15/90 01:40:12 Message Number 4596 Damn, and I was just gettin' ready to put the baseball cards and clothes pins back on my bike spokes. WOW, wonder how much those cards would be worth today if I didn't tear 'em up makin' machine gun noises? Oh yeah?!?!?!?!?! WHAT DOES O.M.A. STAND FOR?!?!?!?!?!?!?! hehehehehe =========== From: SNAKEBYTE To: BEATLE Subject: rOAD rALLY..... Date & Time: 05/15/90 01:42:52 Message Number 4597 Definitely BRADENTON.....home turf and that stuff. I could really pull some chains and use the street NAMEs rather then NUMBERS (RUFUS said NO numbers). But this one was the foundation, next one will be planned (yeah-yeah, I learned my lesson!!!!). =========== From: CORWYN OF AMBER To: DM2 Subject: ::sigh:: Date & Time: 05/15/90 02:55:37 Message Number 4598 > Ya know, I'm eventually gonna figure out what y'all are talking aobut. It's actually quite easy, just go nuts.. it all starts to make sense then. - Corwyn (The career nutcase) =========== From: CORWYN OF AMBER To: BLACK MAGIC Subject: ::sigh:: Date & Time: 05/15/90 02:57:41 Message Number 4599 My reluctance to describe Opus was simply from the fact that my description of that ill-begotten BBS system tend to be /quite/ profane. - Corwyn =========== From: CORWYN OF AMBER To: DONTHEN Subject: New new subject Date & Time: 05/15/90 02:59:59 Message Number 4600 > Assuming the people who write Opus think ANYTING.... - Possible but highly unlikely. I've got a termcap for VT-52 somewhere, but however, I have no idea what the ST's do to it. I had heard somewhere else that Opus did AVATAR, bet when in AVATAR mode on an Opus system, my terminal went nuts, and there was definitly no speed increase.. hmm I'll have to dig up what I do have on AVATAR again myself I guess. I think AVATAR may be an option most Opus sysops don't bother with.. I really don't know however. I've run screaming in the other direction every time I've seen Opus Executables or system docs. (All those Opus sysops /can't/ be running it voluntarily there's gotta be some curse!) From what I got from the little blurb on AVATAR, (now that I think about it, it was probably in Telix's docs.. Avatar's codes are about as short as the VT-52's but they /do/ support color. - Corwyn =========== From: CORWYN OF AMBER To: TURTLE Subject: Lan vs. Mini's Date & Time: 05/15/90 03:13:16 Message Number 4601 Have you read the current PC Magazine? The do a comparison of PC based LANS vs. Mini's with terminals hung off them. They compared: A DEC MicroVAX (4100?) A Compaq SystemPro (w/ Netware 386) An IBM 80 Supersever (w/ Netware 386) A Compaq SystemPro (w/ SCO Unix 386) I was pretty surprised, the SystemPro blew away the Microvax, even when they upgraded to a more expensive model (4800 I think) The LAN's were run on mixed 286's and 386SX's as remote's. They said they were shocked at how slowly the Mini's ran.. DEC (they sent folks to make sure everything was set up correctly and fine-tuned for best performance) was pretty surprised too apparently. The most interesting thing was the Systempro running Unix.. it ran very close to the same speed as the MicroVax, however, it was by far the cheapest! (One SystemPro, and 20 terminals hung of a multiport board.) I can't remember all the stats.. but you should look at the review.. the NC library has it. - Corwyn =========== From: DM2 To: CHIP P. UNICORN Subject: Nusubject (tm) Date & Time: 05/15/90 04:35:36 Message Number 4602 Yeah, and they're good for idiots like me... ;) =========== From: DM2 To: CORWYN OF AMBER Subject: ::sigh:: Date & Time: 05/15/90 04:36:13 Message Number 4603 Ummm I already AM nuts... any more bright suggestions? ---not eccentric...totally out of the circle altogether... =========== From: BEATLE To: TURTLE Subject: IBMs Date & Time: 05/15/90 06:59:23 Message Number 4604 >...takes forever... So, THAT's what the computers at Best were doing when I turned them on ... I thought it was a stpid piece of software that automatically loaded from the A drive. =========== From: BEATLE To: TURTLE Subject: protocensorship Date & Time: 05/15/90 07:01:43 Message Number 4605 I always went by the definittion that censorship was the control of the flow of information, any way. When censoring books, you aren't preventing someone from saying something, they've already said it, you are preventing someone from hearing what was said. What's your term for this? =========== From: BEATLE To: YNGLING Subject: Real dips Date & Time: 05/15/90 07:04:53 Message Number 4606 >abject slavery or eternal damnaton... Yeah, I spoke with him and he believes that if you aren't serving God and bringing people into worshipping, then you are essentially serving the devil. I don't follow that. I don't actually even believe either way ... I believe more in God than the devil, so how can I serve something I don't believe in. My worst gripe about religion is that everyone feels it is their duty to make everyone aware and worship. I feel that if I want to worship, I will. I don't like people intimidating me into doing it if I don't want to. =========== From: BEATLE To: CHIP P. UNICORN Subject: Real dips Date & Time: 05/15/90 07:16:45 Message Number 4607 >psychoanalysis can cure you of that. Good, could you recommend a good psychoanalyst?? I've been wondering wether I should see one or not. =========== From: CHIP P. UNICORN To: CORWYN OF AMBER Subject: Lan vs. Mini's Date & Time: 05/15/90 10:19:37 Message Number 4608 Dear Corwyn, It all depends on how something is set up. Having twenty much slower workstations working on a problem might be faster than having just one reasonably quick computer working on it -- but getting the slower stations to work in sync is a major problem. Chip P. Unicorn =========== From: CHIP P. UNICORN To: BEATLE Subject: Real dips Date & Time: 05/15/90 10:22:17 Message Number 4609 >I don't like people intimidating me into doing it [worshipping] if >I don't want to., Interestingly enough, most Christians believe it's the spiritual heart that's important to God. So, not only are they trying to force you into worshipping a God you might not believe in, but also they're telling you that you'll still go to Hell if you don't believe with your whole heart. If you merely, outwardly recite prayer -- you're still a Krispy Kritter. Chip P. Unicorn =========== From: CHIP P. UNICORN To: BEATLE Subject: Real dips Date & Time: 05/15/90 10:25:12 Message Number 4610 Good old Dr. I. B. Qvack might help you. He's been in the psycho- analysis business for twenty-three years, now, and he guarantees a 73% recovery! Paranoia, schitzophrenia, insomnia, and bucalia -- he's treated them all. Good old Dr. Qvack is completely confidential, and has only published 10% of his patients' names, addresses, and telephone numbers, and transcripts of conversations. This month, Dr. Qvack is having a special: cure two paranoids, get the third one free! Offer expires 5/31/90 -- all cures must be accomplished by this date. Prohibited where void. =========== From: DONTHEN To: CORWYN OF AMBER Subject: New new subject Date & Time: 05/15/90 10:37:41 Message Number 4612 Hm. Well, Opus 1.1x says "Avatar" for the color/IBM graphic mode that I was running it in when /my/ terminal was on ANSI, and had no problems with either Raven's QMODEM-from-hell or the TRS-80's DTERM (well, DTERM did have problems, but they were the same problems it has with most ANSI displays--no IBM graphic characters, of course, and it tries to simulate color changes by flipping reverse video on and off, which only makes things spectacularly ugly). Opus' reference to "Avatar" is the only place I've actually seen it listed; I'm not sure it really exists as a "normal" terminal definition at all -- it may have been something created by whoever took over the Opus project with 1.10 (not the original author, who apparently left the MS-DOS field to port Opus 1.03 to the Macintosh, something I'm sure the Apple world will truly appreciate). =========== From: CORWYN OF AMBER To: DM2 Subject: ::sigh:: Date & Time: 05/15/90 12:05:51 Message Number 4613 I don't understand.. everything should make sense. Now I'm getting confused.. could I (wretch) be getting sane? - unlikely. - Corwyn =========== From: CORWYN OF AMBER To: BEATLE Subject: Real dips Date & Time: 05/15/90 12:08:02 Message Number 4614 > I don't like people intimidating me into doing it if I don't want to. There's an easy solution for this: Intimidate /them/ into /not/ bothering you! ie. "You say one more word about God, and you're going to find out whether you're going to heaven or hell real quick... I'll let you visit one personally!" - Corwyn =========== From: CORWYN OF AMBER To: CHIP P. UNICORN Subject: Lan vs. Mini's Date & Time: 05/15/90 12:10:36 Message Number 4615 The test was for accounting software.. (mostly) However I have seen an ad for a 486 showing a benchmark against a Microvax.. it was twice as fast. Turtle's response: "Yeah, but hang 20 terminals of the VAX, and do the benchmark again!" Well, they did, and the SystemPro still won. I was surprised myself.. but it seems the industry (which has standard- ized on 80x86 systems and LANS isn't quite as stupid as Turtle (and me to some extent) thought. The systems are expensive, but they do manage to perform very well. - Corwyn =========== From: CORWYN OF AMBER To: DONTHEN Subject: New new subject Date & Time: 05/15/90 12:16:48 Message Number 4616 Actually... I've seen Red Ryder, and WWIV (Yes this is a port of the IBM WWIV to the Mac.. and as much as I /hate/ Opus, it will probably be the best Mac Softare around. My Mac-addicted freind once noted that all the good BBS's (Mac exclusive) were run on PC's! There is no stable Mac BBS software currently. Back to topic - I just tried AVATAR on the Chipper Clipper, and it /is/ faster, but probably not worth the trouble of implementing. I try and avoid the 40 color changes a line that some Sysops seem to think is incredibly appealing. I guess 9600 baud users don't mind. - Corwyn =========== From: BLACK MAGIC To: TURTLE Subject: IBMs Date & Time: 05/15/90 16:12:28 Message Number 4620 That's what I thought! Ghods! Sometimes you really bug me....:) The Lady .s (sorry, forgot where I am) =========== From: RUFUS To: CHIP P. UNICORN Subject: Not going... Date & Time: 05/15/90 17:39:36 Message Number 4621 I suppose this mean what I saw of you this weekend was my imagination. And when we went to Arby's in the Green Bitch was also my imagination. ...wonder what kinda gas milage my imagination gets? =========== From: RUFUS To: BEATLE Subject: Something else Date & Time: 05/15/90 17:50:31 Message Number 4622 >he didn't recognize your voice over the speaker. I don't know how that >could happen... Most speaker /I/ run into usually sound really bad. I hear that all the speakers are connected to phone lines that run to Alaska, where there is a microphone two feet away, which is connected to phone lines that run back into the store. This room is located near an airport. This would account for the bad quality. ...did that make sense? I sure hope not. =========== From: RUFUS To: BEATLE Subject: protocensorship Date & Time: 05/15/90 17:59:59 Message Number 4623 That should have been "Saturday Night Five Seconds Late." They had a delay of five seconds just in case Andy slipped. I was wandering around the con looking for someone, and even if I was in the room, the TV had been taken over by the Orlando Society of Cinematographers (or some such group). =========== From: TURTLE To: CHIP P. UNICORN Subject: godtalk Date & Time: 05/15/90 18:23:43 Message Number 4624 Christianity and Islam /are/ the same god, dude; Judiasm, Islam, and Christianity all spring from the same source, consider the Old Testament as a cornerstone of their sacred writings, and worship the being worshipped by the ancient Hebrews. Judiasm stops at the Old Testament (that's the Bible version 1.3); Christians use the Old and New Testaments as the compilation of their faith (the Bible version 2.0), and Muslims the Old Testament and the Koran (the Bible version 2.0[a], beta release). How often have you gone fishing while wearing onl skydiving gear? =========== From: TURTLE To: DM2 Subject: ::sigh:: Date & Time: 05/15/90 18:36:28 Message Number 4625 >I already AM nuts... Well then, you're already halfway to Enlightenment and Inner Peace (tm). Now all you need to do is free yourself from the bonds of rationality and logic, and the True Meaning of Existance (tm) will be revealed to you. Of course, once that happens you begin behaving in a peculiar manner... --An Enlightened (tm) Turtle (c) 1990 Anarchy Now, Inc. All trademarks (tm) 1990 People United for Bob, Inc., a subsidiary of General Dynamics. =========== From: TURTLE To: BEATLE Subject: IBMs Date & Time: 05/15/90 18:39:37 Message Number 4626 The stupid piece of software that automatically loads from the A drive on IBM machines is called "MS-DOS." The stupid piece of software that runs without loading is the "bootstrap loader." If you have a hard disk, the stupid piece of software that runs without loading will automatically load the stupid software that normally loads from the A drive from the C drive. In any event, the stupid logon script that ISN'T a startup alias that executes automatically once the stupid piece of software has loaded is called "AUTOEXEC.BAT," which is a pretty stupid name; on some systems it automatically executes a /really/ stupid piece of software called "Automenu" or a really /amazingly/ stupid piece of software called "Norton Commander" that tries to act like a DOS shell for people with Mac envy. Of course, the stupid piece of software that executes without loading is also capable of loading a somewhat less stupid piece of software called DR-DOS, a decidedly UNstupid piece of software called CP/M-86, or a remarkably good piece of software called UNIX. Sadly, however, it almost never does. --A Z Turtle =========== From: TURTLE To: BEATLE Subject: protocensorship Date & Time: 05/15/90 18:46:15 Message Number 4627 When you cenmsor books, you are effectively preventing someone from saying something in the sense that you are destroying the media which contains that person's message. Censorship is the act of preventing an individual (or individuals) from presenting a message, opinion, or idea publically; obviously, if the message is out there but one particular individual is being denied access to it, that's something other than censorship. (If your mother had called NBC and pressured them to cancel the show, /then/ it would be censorship). =========== From: TURTLE To: CORWYN OF AMBER Subject: Lan vs. Mini's Date & Time: 05/15/90 18:53:14 Message Number 4628 >Well, they did [hang 20 terminals off the SystemPro]... Did they, or did they hang 20 PC's off the SystemPro? In a mini- computing or mainframe environment, you're letting the host do ALL the processing; in a PC LAN, the host is acting as a file server, not a processor, and most of the work is being done by the PC's attached to the file server. (Incidentally, Digital makes a VMS software package that allows a VAX or MicroVAX to act as a file server in a PC LAN, and while it's at it also allows the PC's to access VMS resources and can even act as a bridge to a mainframe, a VAXcluster, a WAN, or a supercomputer file server--all transparentally to the PC user. The PC client software comes with a bundle of TSR programs which can be invoked to put the PC into remote terminal mode for access to VMS, run DECwindows (DEC's XWindows implementation), or communicate with a WAN or SFS or what-have-you, then drop back down into the Lotus-123 mucous you were wallowing in before you escaped to real computing. --A mainframe Turtle By the way, did they also mention how often they ran into file conflicts on the LAN, or how many times they got that silly Error Reading Network: Abort, Retry, Ignore? thing? =========== From: CORWYN OF AMBER To: TURTLE Subject: Lan vs. Mini's Date & Time: 05/16/90 04:22:10 Message Number 4631 One of the tests they ran was to run 20 /terminals/ off of the systempro this was under SCO Unix 386.. It finished ahead of the low end micro- Vax, and a hare beneath the high end. However it's cost is about half. Hmm interesting.. now if you take a Logix 486 and run Unix.. what's the price performance difference? - Corwyn =========== From: CORWYN OF AMBER To: DONTHEN Subject: New new subject Date & Time: 05/16/90 04:25:41 Message Number 4632 I've worked Red Ryder from both ends.. it's configurable, but in very frustrating ways! WWIV.. I remember lot's of headaches, and an interface about on a par with PcBoard.. not exactly top-notch. - Corwyn =========== From: DELPHI To: TURTLE Subject: ibms Date & Time: 05/16/90 08:53:17 Message Number 4633 The problem is that I need to be able to use the WordPerfect version they are using so I can work on their disks. I could conceivably transmit back and forth if the software matched, but the disks don't match either. I will look into this cable, however. I just don't see how it will transmit pure enough for camera-ready copy and that's the quality I need. I wish there would be a way out.... =========== From: DELPHI To: DONTHEN Subject: godtalk Date & Time: 05/16/90 08:57:02 Message Number 4634 Obviously we believe different sources, but I do believe mine are credible. I also believe much of what we have been told throughout patriarchy is conceived to keep us believing in black-and-white reality. For a good look at what may really have happened, check out Elizabeth Gould Davis's The First Sex from Selby Library where she herself was a librarian until her death in the 1970s. One of the assertions she makes (along with Elaine Morgan in The Descent of Woman) and others, is that at one time we were only one gender. It was most surely not what we today think of as female, yet more female than male. Conception was parthenogenic. It was only when the X chromosone mutated into the Y that what we think of as males began to exist. Thus, even the dichotomy of gender differences may be a patriarchal concept. If there were no men, why would there be a male god? All this came later. One note: matriarchal systems are not the opposite of patriarchal. Patriarchary is based on control and ownership. Matriarchy is gynocentric, centered on creation and freedom. I believe where we are now headed is neither matriarchy or patriarchy, but a matrifocal social anarchy where what life and a new kind of inner power is what is valued. =========== From: DONTHEN To: CORWYN OF AMBER Subject: New new subject Date & Time: 05/16/90 14:42:31 Message Number 4635 Well, I didn't say WWIV was /incredible/, just a lot faster. The menu is very reminiscent of PCBoard, but it's fairly easy to use, even if it isn't all that logical and is carved in stone (i.e., hardwired into the program). =========== From: DONTHEN To: DELPHI Subject: godtalk Date & Time: 05/16/90 14:44:23 Message Number 4636 When we were only one gender, there wasn't anything resembling humans around yet. There is an OVERWHELMING amount of evidence to indicate that sexual differentation has been with us since long before the dinosaurs. This also has absolutely nothing to do with politics. I also believe "my" sources--such people as Margaret Murray, considered the foremost anthropological authority on Wicca and the Cult of the Horned God--are accurate. I have a great deal of trouble believing that "patriarchy is based on control and ownership, while matriarchy is based on freedom." This is just too black-and-white for me to be comfortable with. If it is possible to find any counterexamples, you can't make such a blanket statement. Also, a "gynocentric" culture could, in the long run, be no better or worse than an "androcentric" one. Female chauvinism is not an oxymoron; if putting males in a position of too-high importance over females leads to a lot of the problems you stated, doing the reverse would also lead to a set of problems. Different ones, perhaps, but it is still substitution, not solution. While I am not enchanted with the status quo, I think changes have to be gradual (i.e., /have/ to be-- humans don't change overnight, or even over decades), and trying to change existing systems within is not the best tactic, it's the only effective one. Moving towards a truly androgynous system will be the way change is effected; the best thing we can do is try to guide the existing institutions towards that course. Ripping them down and trying to install a benevolent matriarchy in their place is doomed for the same reason trying to install /anything/ in their place quickly is. And, as I said, I think your implicit equation of matriarchal societies with utopia is idealistic at best. =========== From: CHIP P. UNICORN To: RUFUS Subject: Not going... Date & Time: 05/16/90 15:37:22 Message Number 4637 1. Open mouth. 2. Insert hoof. 3. Chew SILENTLY. Chip P. Unicorn =========== From: CHIP P. UNICORN To: TURTLE Subject: ::sigh:: Date & Time: 05/16/90 15:41:53 Message Number 4638 Turtle, You managed to impress a priest of the SubGenius. You're scary. Chip P. Unicorn =========== From: CHIP P. UNICORN To: DELPHI Subject: godtalk Date & Time: 05/16/90 15:45:42 Message Number 4639 Dear Delphi, >It was only when the X chromosone mutated into the Y that what we think >of as males began to exist. Hate to say this, but that happened only a "short while," evolution- arily speaking, after multi-celled animals began. Genetically, it makes more sense to have two genders than one: there is much more chance of genetic unity, and it also helps evolution move forward more quickly. (It allows those who can survive the best to multiply more quickly.) Needless to say, it happened well before even mammals appeared on the Earth. (even before lizards...) You seem to be expressing yourself a dichotomy: that men -- to you -- are inherently controlling and oppressing, and that women are creative and free and good. Do you really mean to say that? Chip P. Unicorn =========== From: YNGLING To: BLACK MAGIC Subject: :) the sequel Date & Time: 05/16/90 16:15:22 Message Number 4640 Dear Lady - Where am I? Where are you? I'm in the middle of buying a three bedroom, two bath mortgage so I havent had much free time...been dealing with loan officers (may they rot in Hell forever...as if I knew where my last four tax returns are at..let alone my last three bank statements!) At this rate I might have to leave A Box Full of Hell to you in my will.  The Yngling "Its a poor sort of memory that only works backward." -Lewis Carroll Through the Looking Glass =========== From: YNGLING To: TURTLE Subject: Arrghhh Date & Time: 05/16/90 16:24:35 Message Number 4641 Turtle, >I never did get the "Cannon Fodder for Christ (tm)" thing. You didnt? I got one absolutely free when I ordered my ginzu miracle potato dicer and car waxer (patent pending, of course). And the best part was that I got to KEEP it free of charge when I sent the ginzu thingymibob back, just for trying it out! Neat, huh? The Yngling =========== From: YNGLING To: BEATLE Subject: Real dips Date & Time: 05/16/90 16:34:09 Message Number 4642 Beatle, As long as we're griping aboiut people preaching...what about those door to door do-gooders? There's nothing worse than hearing your wife's inane little dog barking more than usual, and looking out to see the God Squad walking up to your door, pamphlets in hand, halos on tight. I really hate having to yell at people I dont even know... The Yngling =========== From: C.C.A. To: CHIP P. UNICORN Subject: Real dips Date & Time: 05/16/90 17:05:51 Message Number 4643 I can't answer them either =========== From: C.C.A. To: CHIP P. UNICORN Subject: Question Date & Time: 05/16/90 17:07:44 Message Number 4644 I realize that our pastors and other laypersons are not always from God. Our church just fired a youth minister for doing his job. I don't think that was right, because he did what he was hired for. But, he told some of the rich kids somthing they didn't want to hear. The point is,(this may not be exactly on the subject)he /was/ sent from God and was still persecuted for it. What can I do??(I'm open to suggestions) =========== From: C.C.A. To: BEATLE Subject: Real dips Date & Time: 05/16/90 17:15:16 Message Number 4645 >Is it some sort of odd nature of yours to be more of a religious fanatic in writing than in person?? In a word, YES! =========== From: C.C.A. To: CORWYN OF AMBER Subject: Real dips Date & Time: 05/16/90 17:20:49 Message Number 4646 I'm sorry I offended you.(seriously) I ask your forgiveness. =========== From: C.C.A. To: TURTLE Subject: Waaaay far out Date & Time: 05/16/90 17:28:42 Message Number 4647 I can't really explain it. Ask BEATLE, he told me he can almost under- stand it. =========== From: C.C.A. To: YNGLING Subject: Gimme that.... Date & Time: 05/16/90 17:31:16 Message Number 4648 The word is begotten(sp?).(see John 3:16) =========== From: C.C.A. To: CHIP P. UNICORN Subject: Real dips Date & Time: 05/16/90 17:34:37 Message Number 4649 GOOD JOB, BROTHER!!!!!! =========== From: C.C.A. To: DONTHEN Subject: Real dips Date & Time: 05/16/90 17:37:16 Message Number 4650 Perhaps I should slack off on the religion a little..... =========== From: C.C.A. To: ANGEL Subject: Real dips Date & Time: 05/16/90 17:40:32 Message Number 4651 They must have my capitalized FAITH in a capitalized SOMETHING, or else they would be paranoid that their computers would fall apart while they were using them. =========== From: BEATLE To: C.C.A. Subject: Waaaay far out Date & Time: 05/16/90 18:37:52 Message Number 4653 > Ask BEATLE, he told me he could almost understand it. Don't dump this one on me. I just figured that .... I forgot. I should read your message again. =========== From: DONTHEN To: ALL Subject: Jim Henson Date & Time: 05/17/90 00:04:15 Message Number 4654 died today at 53. =========== From: TURTLE To: DM2 Subject: ::sigh:: Date & Time: 05/17/90 00:23:12 Message Number 4655 >ROFL!!!!!!!!!!!!!!! And SNERG to you, too...:) =========== From: TURTLE To: DELPHI Subject: godtalk Date & Time: 05/17/90 00:25:58 Message Number 4656 Um, I hate to affront your reliable, unbiased, and objective sources, but in the biosphere /we/ live in genetic sex differences exist in every organism more advanced than a planaria, although I can't speak for the authors you named. Quite frankly, I don't see any evidence anywhere in the world of biology, or for that matter in the world of reality, for any organism that is both asexual and recognizably human, much as certain rabid "I-hate-all-men-they-are-all-engaged-in-an-evil- conspiracy" types would like to believe. But of course, that's only because I'm male and therefore (a) automatically a party to the Great Universal Male Conspiracy (tm), (b) willing to believe anything that disagrees with whatever view is put forth by an obviously more enlightened female (who must be right because she's female and therefore unbiased (?), regardless of the validity of her "theories"--to use a term Creationists apply to /their/ rantings, too) and (c) willing to do anything to preserve the male-dominated Grind Females Into Dust (tm) status quo. Therefore, you may feel free to discard both this message and any physical evidence that may support it. Thank you, and have a nice day. --A patriarchial Turtle All trademarks (c) General Dynamics, a subsidiary of Men Are Beasts, Inc. =========== From: TURTLE To: DONTHEN Subject: godtalk Date & Time: 05/17/90 00:33:52 Message Number 4657 What? You mean maybe females can be chauvanists, too? Noooooo! Next you'll be telling me that it's possible for racial minorities to engage in racism! What are you, some kind of liberal pinko right-wing bleeding heart conservative male chauvanist? =========== From: TURTLE To: CHIP P. UNICORN Subject: **sigh** Date & Time: 05/17/90 00:35:47 Message Number 4658 >You managed to impress a priest of the SubGenius. You're scary. God, I love being a Turtle! =========== From: TURTLE To: C.C.A. Subject: Real ice cream Date & Time: 05/17/90 00:43:37 Message Number 4659 >Perhaps I should slack off on the religion a little.... The quest for Slack, grasshopper, is one of the fundamental challenges of this mortal life. The Way to Slack is the Way to Inner Peace, Happiness, and Freedom from Obnoxious TV Advertising. The Road to Slack can be found through faith in Bob, the pinnacle of Slack. Join Bob through his holy institution, the Church of the SubGenius, and YOU can buy the Universal Secret, too! The Church of the SubGenius can be your eternal salvation, or triple your money refunded. Remember, the Church of the Subgenius is the /only/ church which can make that guarantee, because it's the One True Religion that's better than all the other One True Religions put together. Remember, the longest journey starts with a single payment... --An enlightened Turtle (c) 1990 Turtles United For Bob =========== From: DM2 To: DONTHEN Subject: Jim Henson Date & Time: 05/17/90 03:54:59 Message Number 4660 And a terrible loss it is for ALL of us, adults and children alike. :'( =========== From: DM2 To: TURTLE Subject: ::sigh:: Date & Time: 05/17/90 03:56:17 Message Number 4661 Ummmmmmm Was that in English? ;) =========== From: CORWYN OF AMBER To: DONTHEN Subject: New new subject Date & Time: 05/17/90 04:42:28 Message Number 4663 True.. I still don't get why anybody still uses pcboard. I can see where some users /might/ like it better since all the commands are always the same, which I don't particulary have a real problem with... it's just that I haven't yet seen a /good/ hardwired bbs setup. This means it /has/ to have hotkeys.. (no I don't mean the kind where you wait for the menu to finish /then/ can hit a key without return) I mean that when you hit the key, the program DOES IT! - Corwyn =========== From: CORWYN OF AMBER To: C.C.A. Subject: Real dips Date & Time: 05/17/90 04:54:29 Message Number 4664 Frankly, I'm not offended by you personally, I'm offended by the whole exclusivist concept. Your entire religion offends me. I don't understand how people can be so smug and arrogant. The claim "You're either serving God or Satan" I find quite pompous and annoying. - Corwyn =========== From: KEN OBER To: BEATLE Subject: Real dips Date & Time: 05/17/90 12:47:29 Message Number 4665 > could you recommend a good psychoanalyst?? A home labotomy would be just as good, and cheaper, too! =========== From: KEN OBER To: YNGLING Subject: A Problem... Date & Time: 05/17/90 12:52:47 Message Number 4666 I wanted to tell YOU (And anyone else who may have had this problem) on the Petra system, that sometimes it doesn't save new user information But don't worry, Paragon is being sent 2-Day Air-Mail.... =========== From: YNGLING To: C.C.A. Subject: Gimme that.... Date & Time: 05/17/90 16:22:27 Message Number 4667 No, I meant "forgotten." The Yngling =========== From: SPELLWIND To: CHIP P. UNICORN Subject: I'm baaaack! Date & Time: 05/17/90 16:48:45 Message Number 4668 Hi! Couldn't keep me off the waves for long! I'm back! A new and improved human Spellwind! =========== From: SPELLWIND To: YNGLING Subject: Witnesses Date & Time: 05/17/90 16:58:14 Message Number 4669 A jehova's witness came to my door the other day. I never met a JW before then. They're quite consevatively dressed, yet liberal at the mo- uth. I had to close the door on her. Anyone coming to my door to invade my freedom of religion in the middle of the afternoon disturbing my hy- bernation by explaining her beleifs to me and shoving pamphlets in my fists deserves more than just a polite doorslamming. ( After I told her how false i felt the christian religion was) =========== From: SPELLWIND To: CHIP P. UNICORN Subject: medeival Date & Time: 05/17/90 17:05:18 Message Number 4670 I put the medeival Europe and today together and find they're alar- mingly alike! They're broadcasting their "one true beleif" on televis- ion and radio, they influence laws, they censor anything they don't li- ke and silence anyone they want. I want them stopped before they start burning again! You may not look at it all that much but they are in co- ntrol! They decide what's moral and what's a satanical influence to co- ntrol us and turn us into mindless slaves, but it's THEM who are turning you into mindless slaves! They are in control! Any non-christian had better worry, they think Winger is a satanic, unmoral, brainwashing evil influence (yes Winger!)!! a concerned for my freedom Spellwind. =========== From: SPELLWIND To: C.C.A. Subject: You Date & Time: 05/17/90 17:41:03 Message Number 4672 You're a very insecure person, you know. You look for something to cling onto and hold on no matter how unstable it is. You have been talk- ed to by so many people here, yet you cling to your cross because it's all you have. are you afraid of exploring the possibility that you're wrong? Boy, you need a confidence booster. =========== From: BLACK MAGIC To: CHIP P. UNICORN Subject: God... Date & Time: 05/17/90 18:22:51 Message Number 4674 :) The Lady =========== From: BLACK MAGIC To: CORWYN OF AMBER Subject: ::sigh:: Date & Time: 05/17/90 18:24:55 Message Number 4675 *sigh* Hehehehe...now, now. Be a nice boy. Write your papers, get a's and then GO TO SLEEP! The Lady =========== From: BLACK MAGIC To: BEATLE Subject: Real dips Date & Time: 05/17/90 18:27:40 Message Number 4676 Collin / Audrey Babcock (now divorced, but excellent) There are many others, but these two are really good. I worked in the Psych field for a couple of years....trust me....(btw, whens the last time you trusted someone who said "trust me"?) The Lady....:> =========== From: BLACK MAGIC To: TURTLE Subject: IBMs Date & Time: 05/17/90 18:39:04 Message Number 4677 Nice damn attitude! I happen to use NCC! QED! My, my..... =========== From: BLACK MAGIC To: YNGLING Subject: :) the sequel Date & Time: 05/17/90 18:44:27 Message Number 4678 Now, now...I am *ever* sorry. Just smile...everything will work out, I'm sure. Well, I hope I don't get it through your will...I'd much prefer if you were alive while I borrow /it/. Hmm...funny, were about to but another set of car payments...ugh! And it's got to be a VOLVO, too! ("they have steel bodies, they have air bags, they are S*A*F*E*... a word I despise!) The Lady =========== From: BLACK MAGIC To: CORWYN OF AMBER Subject: Real dips Date & Time: 05/17/90 18:51:41 Message Number 4679 Very well put. I've nothing against religion, until, of course, someone starts pushing it on me. _The Lady =========== From: BLACK MAGIC To: SPELLWIND Subject: Adam Date & Time: 05/17/90 18:54:19 Message Number 4680 I do choose to disagree...or better put, ARGUE! I, for one, am a Jew, and I, for one, was raised in synagogue. AND I FOR ONE know that your statement about women being "brainwashed into believing /all of this/ we are controlled by men" is FALSE. How wrong of you to speak an unfair, untruth. You are not female, nor are you Jewish. Nor, apparently, do you know much about the Jewish religion and what we, as children or adults, are taught. QED! -An ANGRY Lady =========== From: SPELLWIND To: BLACK MAGIC Subject: hmm Date & Time: 05/17/90 19:04:12 Message Number 4681 Ahem..... Sizzle, Milady. =========== From: SPELLWIND To: BLACK MAGIC Subject: Adam Date & Time: 05/17/90 19:16:48 Message Number 4682 So not to offend, Milady, I have deleted the message. But everything written there I strongly beleive. ( Is 'lady' correct? ) Don't start. =========== From: ACAPULCO To: CHIP P. UNICORN Subject: Real solutions Date & Time: 05/17/90 19:29:04 Message Number 4683 I'm not missing the point. I don't have the Book in front of me, and I'm not prone to memorization, but plants would not likely constitute the definition being discussed in the passage. Plants would have been ignored in the poetics of the scripture. {Acapulco} =========== From: ACAPULCO To: ANGEL Subject: What I'm doing. Date & Time: 05/17/90 19:34:56 Message Number 4684 Indeed, it happens all too often to me... it might be a symptom of disorganization on my part. I can't speak for you (even if I *had* met you, which I have not). Looks like one more idea going the way of the wind. {Acapulco} =========== From: BLACK MAGIC To: SPELLWIND Subject: hmm Date & Time: 05/17/90 23:08:40 Message Number 4685 :> Sizzle, not me. You see, milord, I never sizzle...I only fry. -The Lady In Black =========== From: BLACK MAGIC To: SPELLWIND Subject: Adam Date & Time: 05/17/90 23:09:40 Message Number 4686 Yes, LADY is correct. Though you may choose not to believe so, I am a lady...or if one prefers, a young woman. So, tell me, while we're at it how the hell are you? (You asked me not to start, therefore, I haven't However, this does not prove your theory that women are controlled by men as a valid one...) Smarter than you think, eh? :> (*Don't start w/ me...let's be nice*) Black Magic / The LADY =========== From: TURTLE To: BLACK MAGIC Subject: God... Date & Time: 05/17/90 23:21:06 Message Number 4687 >:) Succinct. I like that. =========== From: TURTLE To: BLACK MAGIC Subject: IBMs Date & Time: 05/17/90 23:22:03 Message Number 4688 >Nice damn attitude! Yes. >I happen to use NCC! Mac envy in someone who calls Amigas "toys?" My, my, my. >QED! :P >My my my! Your your your WHAT? =========== From: TURTLE To: SNAKEBYTE Subject: Hey, dude! Date & Time: 05/17/90 23:26:52 Message Number 4689 I finally got a chance to play with DR-DOS, and guess what? It wouldn't boot! The system disk is garphled beyond recognition. *Sigh* I hate when that happens... =========== From: DONTHEN To: TURTLE Subject: godtalk Date & Time: 05/17/90 23:46:24 Message Number 4690 That's "chauvinist," not "chauvanist." If you're asking if I think Germaine Greer is being chauvinistic when she keeps men from her autograph sessions on the current promotional tour she's doing for her book, "Daddy", or I think Spike Lee is being racist for refusing to talk to white fans of his when he was visiting New York City a few months ago--doing so under the pretense that they're not really fans but are just humoring him because he's black... well, yes. If a male author kept women fans out of his autograph sessions, or a white director refused to talk to black fans, you can bet the "chauvinist" and "racist" epithets would be flying, and rightly so. Maybe I'm missing something crucial, but it would seem that for those terms to have any meaning, they have to be applied /equally/, regardless of which sex is being chauvinist or which color is being racist. After all, they wouldn't be problems if the issue of equality wasn't a problem to begin with. =========== From: DONTHEN To: CORWYN OF AMBER Subject: New new subject Date & Time: 05/17/90 23:51:34 Message Number 4691 Considering I wrote a BBS in interpreted BASIC that had hotkeys (it would have to finish printing out the current command name it was on, or sometimes the current line, but not the entire menu), I'm not sure why they're not used more often. It's really not all that difficult... just execute the equivalent of INKEY$ every character (or if you're cheap--or writing in interpreted BASIC--after every word or line), and if a key's been pressed, check to see if it's a valid command key and go to it if it is, otherwise throw it out and continue printing as if nothing's happened. Oh, well.... =========== From: DONTHEN To: SPELLWIND Subject: medeival Date & Time: 05/17/90 23:54:48 Message Number 4692 Winger isn't Satanic. They're kind of short and blue, but not Satanic. -D- [down with Smurf metal!] =========== From: DONTHEN To: ACAPULCO Subject: Incidentally, Date & Time: 05/17/90 23:57:30 Message Number 4693 the 'second version' of "Satisfaction" is apparently being rejected by FurVersion for being too nasty. The sex in it isn't as explicit as some of the stories FV's printed--including a few by the editor of the 'zine--but evidently he's edgy about printing something with graphic violence, even though it's (or should be) obviously a Clive Barker-type horror story. By the way, are you still considering sending a copy of that to the horror writer on your information service?.... =========== From: CORWYN OF AMBER To: BLACK MAGIC Subject: ::sigh:: Date & Time: 05/18/90 06:54:05 Message Number 4694 Write my papers?!?!? Yuck.. why would I do something stupid like that? - Corwyn =========== From: CORWYN OF AMBER To: BLACK MAGIC Subject: IBMs Date & Time: 05/18/90 06:55:13 Message Number 4695 When he start's making fun of the name of 'AUTOEXEC.BAT' you know he's getting desperate. They're going to crawl into his home while he's asleep.. the creeping MS-DOS plauge (sic) - Corwyn =========== From: CORWYN OF AMBER To: TURTLE Subject: IBMs Date & Time: 05/18/90 06:59:54 Message Number 4696 Norton Commander as Mac envy.. grow up Turtle. Norton commander's simply a very usefull file management tool. However, when I get tired of it.. I /quit/ and go back to the bare, naked command line. I don't like to not have any choice /but/ the command line.. but I'd really be upset if someone stuck me in a brain damaged shell (Mac Finder) and wouldn't let me back to my command line. Mac envy?? Ha! I /might/ envy a Mac IIfx running A/UX, but even that runs under finder.. so it probably crashes regularly.. Mac = Ate my document. - Corwyn =========== From: CORWYN OF AMBER To: DONTHEN Subject: New new subject Date & Time: 05/18/90 07:05:40 Message Number 4697 I don't get it either.. are they /trying/ to make thier BBS software inconvenient? - Corwyn =========== From: TURTLE To: --- Subject: --- Date & Time: 05/19/90 02:09:03 Message Number 4700 :Test Message: =========== From: TURTLE To: CORWYN OF AMBER Subject: IBMs Date & Time: 05/19/90 02:29:35 Message Number 4702 Tsk, tsk, tsk. Such strong words...Lest you get the right idea, I'm not especially fond of Macs (even though A/UX doesn't, in fact, run under Finder...although you can run Finder applications under IT). However, I do find it amusing that people who sneer at Macs (the same people, mind you, who run 8-bit operating systems on 32-bit machines) seem so entranced with the whole windows-icons-and- mice "thang"...it's like they *want* to have a cute Mac interface but don't want to admit that there's something about the Mac that they like. (BTW, have you seen IBM's new PS/2 promotional tack? They're pushing the PS/2 as a Mac-like computer that costs less now..."We have mice, just like the Macintosh! We have windows, just like the Macintosh!" Hehehe!) =========== From: TURTLE To: ALL Subject: -System Crash- Date & Time: 05/19/90 02:34:06 Message Number 4703 Yep, folks, the system crashed AGAIN yesterday during a logon session (the culprit this time being our very own Chip P. Unicorn...) Normally, that would involve a downtime of about half an hour to restore a backup, and Devil take any messages that were posted after the last backup; this time, though, the reptile got *really* pissed at the prospect of losing a hundred or so messages and rebuilt the message file by hand. Hence, anyone who called for the last eighteen hours or so didn't get through. I'm pleased to say, though, that the message base has been restored with the loss of only one message...unfortunately, it was a mail message, and Ghod only knows who it was from or who it was intended for. If you've left anyone E-mail lately (like, on the 17th or 18th), you might want to do it again just to make sure it gets where it's destined. Thank you for your patience... --An impatient, and aggravated, Turtle who *really hates* this BBS software =========== From: CHIP P. UNICORN To: C.C.A. Subject: Question Date & Time: 05/19/90 05:21:21 Message Number 4705 >He was sent from God and was still persecuted for it. Read both the OT and the NT... being from God almost ensures persecution. Face it, God refuses to stop people in His fold from being persecuted... all He promises is that we'll have the strength to endure. (Read James 1.) Actually, I'm curious: could you tell me more details about the story? Chip P. Unicorn =========== From: CHIP P. UNICORN To: C.C.A. Subject: Real dips Date & Time: 05/19/90 05:24:03 Message Number 4706 Why do you feel it's more important to be more of a fanatic in writing? Just be yourself, C.C.A., and people will like you. The people in BBS-land don't know anything about your background -- you're starting here with a completely (well -- almost completely...) clean slate. Join in -- as yourself. Chip P. Unicorn =========== From: CHIP P. UNICORN To: DONTHEN Subject: Jim Henson Date & Time: 05/19/90 05:28:11 Message Number 4707 Dear Donthen, Jim Henson AND Sammy Davis, Jr. both died yesterday. And Lithuania decided to take back all of the laws they've passed as an independent country since March. <*SIGH!*> Where's those hot, horny fox drinks? Chip P. Unicorn =========== From: CHIP P. UNICORN To: TURTLE Subject: Real ice cream Date & Time: 05/19/90 05:32:49 Message Number 4708 Dear Turtle, Don't be fooled by Bob-ism! It's just another religion! Are you sick and tired of shaven-headed, whimpering, pathetic, cliquish SubGenius bookworms pretending like they're actually going to overthrow the Conspiracy when they can't even make a living? The Church of "Don" exudes mockery and hatred for J. R. "Bob" Dobbs and his silly followers, the Church of the SubGenius. Don't get taken in -- it's just another religion, folks! We follow an infinite hierarchy of monosyllabically named, male, 50's, pipe-smoking salesmen -- all end- lessly parodying each other. Art and invention are pointless! The Church of "Don" doesn't promise you one damn thing, but it will cost you a dollar! The Church of "Don" -- 8701 Evergreen, Little Rock, Arkansas 72207 (c) 1990, Unicorns apathetic about Bob =========== From: CHIP P. UNICORN To: SPELLWIND Subject: I'm baaaack! Date & Time: 05/19/90 05:39:10 Message Number 4709 ....hmmm... why was I the one that was warned about this?... Uh, welcome back to the, uh, waves. We've, uh, really missed you. C.P.U. =========== From: CHIP P. UNICORN To: SPELLWIND Subject: medeival Date & Time: 05/19/90 05:41:54 Message Number 4710 Dear Spellwind, I'm completely confused. 1. How, precisely, is Europe censoring broadcasts from the U.S.? Also, which "One True Belief" is Europe claiming to broad- cast? Last I checked, about half of Europe was Protestant, and half was Catholic... 2. How could Europe be so closely banded together that it would have the power to do such things? Last I checked, they were still having problems with economic unity in 1992 -- with no plans whatsoever for political unity. 3. Who, what, or why is Winger? I'll be glad to respond once I understand these things. Chip P. Unicorn =========== From: CHIP P. UNICORN To: BLACK MAGIC Subject: God... Date & Time: 05/19/90 05:46:50 Message Number 4711 Seeing thy smile flitter by mine eyes has made the sun shine ever more brightly. Thank thee. Chip P. Unicorn =========== From: CHIP P. UNICORN To: ACAPULCO Subject: Real solutions Date & Time: 05/19/90 05:49:46 Message Number 4712 (I'm assuming we're talking about what I call the "first contradiction of the Bible," no?) I quoted the verses some messages back, but I would call "shrubs" plants, no? The whole verse I'm referring to is: (Wait a sec... sorry, forgot: Sauron, please abort now. I'm about to quote a Bible verse, which means I must be prosletizing, no?) "When the Lord God made the earth and the heavens -- and no shrub of the field had yet appeared on the earth and no plant of the field had yet sprung up... the Lord God formed the man from the dust of the ground and breathed into his nostrils the breath of life, and the man became a living being." (Genesis 2:4b,5,7) Question: Did God make man before, or after the plants? Chip P. Unicorn =========== From: CHIP P. UNICORN To: TURTLE Subject: --- Date & Time: 05/19/90 06:02:30 Message Number 4714 :Test Response: =========== From: CHIP P. UNICORN To: TURTLE Subject: -System Crash- Date & Time: 05/19/90 06:03:47 Message Number 4715 Dear Turle, I didn't crash the board once... I crashed it TWICE! The Mad System Crasher Strikes Again! Chip P. Unicorn =========== From: SPELLWIND To: BLACK MAGIC Subject: -- Date & Time: 05/19/90 07:29:31 Message Number 4716 I'm great! Haven't heard from you in a while. =========== From: SPELLWIND To: DONTHEN Subject: godtalk Date & Time: 05/19/90 07:31:20 Message Number 4717 I think women have a right to be chauvanistic. =========== From: SPELLWIND To: CHIP P. UNICORN Subject: Dude Date & Time: 05/19/90 07:36:53 Message Number 4718 Nonsense! The church of Dude gives no constrictions. Become a disci- ple of the church of Dude, previously known as the Churc of the NonConf- ormist Rebels without Causes and lenient judges pleading Insufficient evidence. This has been a public service message from the church of Dude. =========== From: SPELLWIND To: CHIP P. UNICORN Subject: Ugh.. Date & Time: 05/19/90 07:41:37 Message Number 4719 Why do I open my mouth! Chip always has something strange to comment about my rarely serious posts. kudos to Gorbachev. =========== From: JONBOY To: SAURON Subject: They hate... Date & Time: 05/19/90 07:55:19 Message Number 4720 Read any good books on statistics with an introduction on relevance and statistically significant samples? Also try a book on debate as you just committed a non-sequitar (sheesh - rank amateurs!) =========== From: JONBOY To: SAURON Subject: abuse Date & Time: 05/19/90 07:57:57 Message Number 4721 Well, I for one could care less (I have 2 MSDOS machines, an Apple, several CP/M machines, a couple of Pocket computers) and this is the crux of a real problem where /les enfant terrible's/ (brats in American) brag about their hardware (no puns please!). Hell I'm happy just to /have/ computers!!!! The next problem is one of perception - brats come in all age groups and it is a disservice to slam them as the progenitors of your grief in the form of "16 year olds". Nay! Brats are much more universal and pervasive than that! They would not /dream/ of restrictin themselves to that peculiar age bracket. Summary: Lay off the young people as a brunt for your insecurities. If *you* make a decision then *you* are the only one that must live with it =========== From: JONBOY To: CORWYN OF AMBER Subject: Xnty... Date & Time: 05/19/90 08:07:17 Message Number 4722 Yeah now *there's* one that Turtle could go for! =========== From: JONBOY To: CORWYN OF AMBER Subject: windows Date & Time: 05/19/90 08:09:52 Message Number 4723 Have you used Windows??? Man When I start to do a printout from Windows I go to lunch. When I get back it *might* be started!!! (what's really scary is this is really true! Graphics printing I have seen take 43 minutes to fire up the laser printer and get on with it). It is nice to not have to worry about configuring every single program that you install as Windows handles the interfaces. I haven't seen OS/2 but I have heard the screams of pain and being a pussy I stay away. =========== From: JONBOY To: CORWYN OF AMBER Subject: Real dips Date & Time: 05/19/90 08:13:53 Message Number 4724 Kinda like a balance of power with no "break-even" point. If you fall to the left - you have done good if you fall to the right well... There is no one that is free of "sin" even the Bible will tell you that What makes the difference is the state of Grace that you are in. If you have accepted Jesus as Lord & Saviour then you are in a state of Grace. Grace is defined as getting something you really couldn't have "earned" If you are not in Grace then you are doomed because you had the chance to listen and believe. Look at the bright side - you will have company there whichever side you go to. I dunno how eternal flames are as far as being conducive to conversation..... =========== From: JONBOY To: CORWYN OF AMBER Subject: Real dips Date & Time: 05/19/90 08:19:04 Message Number 4725 You're right - mindless conformance IS disgusting! However - I believe that you are overdue for your suicide. What you say????!!!! Well - you just stated that if you can't be in control of your own life then it isn't worth living. I won't even bother to list the many and varied ways that just OUR government has for controlling your life. God doesn't make you pay your 10 % tithe - Can you opt NOT to pay your taxes like a good little boy? ( I couldn't resist 1 example). Stop being such an arrogant fool in slamming other's beliefs. Better minds than yours have examined the question of God - some agreed and some disagreed but at least they examined the question with some kind of systematic plan and did not go about trying to stomp out all the pissants in the world that bothered them. Please note that this does *NOT*!!!! include idiots that persecuted others in the name of religion My idea of a healthy mind and attitude is one where words and ideas are as far as it goes when debating with another over an abstract concept that has no bearing on anyone but the individual. I mean it does not affect me at all whether you believe or not. Just as it does not affect you whether I believe or not. Leave it at that and quit trying to instigate your own form of inquisition. =========== From: JONBOY To: DONTHEN Subject: 286: Stone Age Date & Time: 05/19/90 08:31:05 Message Number 4726 We use 'em because they *are* so cheap! I can get a 12 Mhz motherboard for $135 - add a ne1000 network card for $200 and a MetraByte PIO24 card for $150. Voila! A 640K machine controller that boots up on the network where I can have a program written in C or assembler to run a machine. I can also do a remote control act with this thing from my desk or at home. =========== From: JONBOY To: TURTLE Subject: godtalk Date & Time: 05/19/90 08:34:52 Message Number 4727 Ohhhhhh but what about the aliens (benevolent of course) that have been nuturing our race for eons until we can join the galactic community where we can finally realize our potential? They beam a healing and health ray at 27.14356 Mhz.. But beware! They also have a ray that brings on signs of senility and can turn entire worlds into slobbering idiots - this is a broadband ray that covers from about 52 Mhz to over 400 Mhz. Unfortunately we discovered all to easily how to create a device to receive these emanations. =========== From: JONBOY To: TURTLE Subject: Real dips Date & Time: 05/19/90 08:41:23 Message Number 4728 Actually in the higher levels of Free Masonry they are taught that there WAS a terrible mistake and that Lucifer - angel of light is the REAL creator and lord and that Yahweh is a dirty little usurper that will get his at Armageddon. Just goes to show that humans will try all combinations of reality and fiction till they come up with something that pleases THEM. =========== From: JONBOY To: TURTLE Subject: Real beanheads Date & Time: 05/19/90 08:44:32 Message Number 4729 Turtle - you are a baaa-baaaad boy. =========== From: JONBOY To: CHIP P. UNICORN Subject: Xnty... Date & Time: 05/19/90 08:51:37 Message Number 4730 Cat's Cradle -- Also try Still Life with Woodpecker by Tom Robbins =========== From: BLACK MAGIC To: TURTLE Subject: God... Date & Time: 05/19/90 09:06:50 Message Number 4731 :> :> :> :> >: :> :> :> Can you figure out which one doesn't belong? .s =========== From: RUFUS To: ANGEL Subject: New crusade Date & Time: 05/19/90 10:49:38 Message Number 4732 >The front parts ain't too shabby as well. Why thank you ever so much. You've made my day (even if the message is 5-6 days late). BTW, I saw you on TV 2-3 nights ago. I began jumping up and down screaming "I know her, I know her." I'm easily amused by that TV device. ...I admit it, I still stick my tongue out whenever I walk by a video camera in the store. =========== From: RUFUS To: ANGEL Subject: What I'm doing. Date & Time: 05/19/90 11:00:21 Message Number 4733 >Don't you just hate it when one of your creations simply refuses to >die on cue? I've got your solution. Put said creation (disks, hardcopies, & little notes you scribbled on napkins) into a cardboard box. Tape the box up. Take the box to the Dunkin' Donuts on Lee Rd. in Orlando. Wait until 4 a.m., then place the box in the middle of the parking lot. Set box on fire and stand back. ...While your waiting, go inside, harass the manager, eat some munchkins. =========== From: RUFUS To: SNAKEBYTE Subject: rOAD rALLY..... Date & Time: 05/19/90 11:05:59 Message Number 4734 Cool story about Bradenton. I went up there to purchase an RC car from some guy I knew on the BBS. Well, his address was something like 3333 17th St. N. I found 17th St. W. (or some street that had a 17 in it), drove down 5 houses, and found the house that had the EXACT same street #. I knocked on the door and asked for Scott. The lady said Scott wasn't home. Then she asked if I meant Scott Smith. Before I go back to bed and confuse everyone even more, I'll some up what I'm attempting to say. I was on a street that had the same # but diffrent direction (W not N), had the same house #, and had a kid by the same name living there. =========== From: RUFUS To: YNGLING Subject: Real dips Date & Time: 05/19/90 11:20:55 Message Number 4735 When we see them coming, my dad and I run for cover in the kitchen while mom deals with them. Mom's not into high pressure, so she usually purchases a pamphlet or two. I love the line "We want to /save/ you, and it'll only cost you 50 cents." I did find the article describing how clean your house/bathroom/armpits/car should be interesting. Ever since I've thought up fun ways to deal with these people, they haven't come around. =========== From: RUFUS To: KEN OBER Subject: Real dips Date & Time: 05/19/90 11:27:17 Message Number 4736 >A home labotomy would be just as good, and cheaper, too! No no no! Bungee jumping is the cure to all your problems. Your turtle was much happier after his 3-4 jumps (did we get those on tape?). Not to mention we amused everyone in the patio area. ...Remember: If your not bungee jumping, your not bungee jumping. =========== From: RUFUS To: SPELLWIND Subject: I'm baaaack! Date & Time: 05/19/90 11:30:20 Message Number 4737 >A new and improved human Spellwind! It slices, it dices, it washes the car /and/ watches the kid. And best yet, it doesn't require any batteries. No, it digests it's own brain. [And now, a Public Service Message: The Spellwind 2000 has been found to have one major flaw. Upon eating the brain unit, the Spellwind 2000 does silly thing like slice the kids, dice the car, and watch food, not to mention call BBS systems.] Anyways, welcome back to the BBS world. =========== From: RUFUS To: JONBOY Subject: abuse Date & Time: 05/19/90 11:52:09 Message Number 4738 You mentioned, several hundred messages back, that you had some Apple magazines you'd be willing to part with. I never replied because I was going to in E-mail, but had to hang-up so the Sigh-Sop could use his own phone line [talk about pushy! :)]. Anyways, what are the details, and if the price is right, I'll take 'em. If it's one thing I need, it's more stuff to clutter up my room. =========== From: RUFUS To: TURTLE Subject: Messages Date & Time: 05/19/90 11:59:15 Message Number 4739 Turle dude, I just read 200 messages. And your BBS is double spacing everything. Ackk...arggh....yack....yip...beep bop biff bang. ....The one true way, the way of the bungee! =========== From: KEN OBER To: RUFUS Subject: Real dips Date & Time: 05/19/90 14:00:37 Message Number 4740 Well, I don't think you got the Bungee jumping turtle on tape...Last night was the FIRST EVER full screening of the ENTIRE UNEDITED Oasis tape -- It is about 2 hours, and about 75% we were busy laughing at interesting things -- I'll have to edit out some boring stuff, tho... And it looks as if the music video will be REAL LONG ... There will also be a video for TURTLE CAM IV and DOG CAM I and II .... Anyways, I'll distribute it to everyone when I finally figure it out! This one will take awhile to compile.... =========== From: TURTLE To: CHIP P. UNICORN Subject: medeival Date & Time: 05/19/90 14:50:07 Message Number 4741 >3. Who, or what, is Winger? Winger is an inexplicably popular smurf-metal group without even the intellectual depth of, say, Bon Jovi. For answers to your other questions, you will have to contact a higher authority than I, but I hope I have in some small way enlightened you at least a little and made your life a bit less confusing... =========== From: TURTLE To: CHIP P. UNICORN Subject: Contradictions Date & Time: 05/19/90 14:52:45 Message Number 4742 I really hate to admit this, Chip, but the Biblical verse you cited doesn't really contain a contradiction. In a rather metaphoric way, I would say it is simply making the case that God made man before there was /agriculture,/ not before there were /plants./ (There is a difference between a plant and a "plant of the field," and frankly the use of the word "shrub" in that context looks more like an off-the- cuff translation of some peculiar Hebrew word than like a reference to a tree standing less than three feet high...) Interpreted that way, the verse makes perfect sense and fits quite nicely into both the "other" account of the genesis AND the history of the world as it was known to the Hebrews... =========== From: TURTLE To: CHIP P. UNICORN Subject: -System Crash- Date & Time: 05/19/90 14:56:34 Message Number 4743 Well, to be technically correct, the system was crashed by a garphled sector in the message index file...you just happened to be the person wh hit it first. Sorry. =========== From: TURTLE To: SPELLWIND Subject: FemTalk (tm) Date & Time: 05/19/90 14:57:30 Message Number 4744 >I think women have the right to be chauvanistic. Nobody has the right to be chauvanistic. The "turnabout is fair play" concept simply doesn't apply here, regardless of how much chauvanism women have faced in the past. None of it has come from me, and I don't recognize anybody's rights to behave in a prejudiced fashion toward me simply because some random male was behaving that way toward her. You might just as well say "I think blacks have the right to keep white slaves." It just don't work that way. --A non-chauvanistic Turtle who expects a similar courtesy from people who talk to /him/. =========== From: TURTLE To: JONBOY Subject: They hate... Date & Time: 05/19/90 15:01:53 Message Number 4745 >sheesh - rank amateurs! Sauron? A rank amateur? Are you /serious?/ Sauron is a Grand Master at the art of the non-sequitur! =========== From: TURTLE To: JONBOY Subject: New Subject: Date & Time: 05/19/90 15:05:57 Message Number 4746 >If you are not in Grace then you are doomed because you had the >chance to listen and believe. Personally, I would say that that is insufficient as a cause to condemn someone to Hell simply because /everybody/ gets the chance to "listen and believe" in, oh, half a dozen different religions on a good day and God doesn't seem to have provided any evidence that his is better than any other...but at any rate, that raises a question I have never received a satisfactory answer to from any Christians I've talked to. Does an individual who spends his entire life never, ever having heard of Christianity, Jesus Christ, or any of the other Christian ideas go to hell for committing the unforgivable sin of ignorance? =========== From: TURTLE To: JONBOY Subject: Reality Date & Time: 05/19/90 15:12:25 Message Number 4747 >Just goes to show that humans will try all combinations of reality and >fictiontill they come up with something that pleases THEM. Yes. Trouble is, they believe their fictitious construct as absolutely as somebody with a different view believes HIS. With no evidence to support one view over the other, that's kind of inevidable. (Wouldn't /you/ be surprised if you died and made the discovery that the Freemasons were right??) Conviction alone--yours, theirs, or a Witch's, or a Hindu's, or even a Baptist's--is insufficient to establish validity. =========== From: TURTLE To: BLACK MAGIC Subject: God... Date & Time: 05/19/90 15:17:22 Message Number 4748 >:> :> :> :> >: :> :> :> Can you figure out which one doesn't belong? >.s Yes! The ".s"! =========== From: TURTLE To: RUFUS Subject: Messages Date & Time: 05/19/90 15:20:58 Message Number 4749 >...your BBS is double-spacing everything. Yes, I know. That's because I created a device called *FF in the operating system's device table, assigned it to a handler called FORMS, and filtered everything being sent to the device *CL (the communications line) through the *FF device. I then told the FORMS driver to add a linefeed to every carriage return it saw, with the upshot that everything going out to the modem had an extra linefeed attached to it. Why did I do this? Well, it stems from insecurity... I wanted to do something that that "other" 8-bit operating system that's more popular than mine couldn't do. Sorry...I've reset the *CL device and removed the *FF device, so everything's all better now... =========== From: SPELLWIND To: TURTLE Subject: Winger Date & Time: 05/19/90 19:22:42 Message Number 4750 The words Winger and Metal Don't Fit. =========== From: SPELLWIND To: TURTLE Subject: Past Lives Date & Time: 05/19/90 19:24:36 Message Number 4751 I'm pretty sure that in my most previous past life I was a female. I don't know, I think I'm starting to regress. =========== From: RAVEN To: C.C.A. Subject: Real dips Date & Time: 05/19/90 21:06:56 Message Number 4752 But there are different levels of worship, and many dieties who are _far_ from evil. It is not a choice between "God" and "Satan", but rather how one lives one's life. I know people who are atheistic, and hold to the 'christian' ideals much more than most of the christians I have met. One's works are of import, not whether or not one prays to a specific young and warlike diety. -R- =========== From: RAVEN To: C.C.A. Subject: Real dips Date & Time: 05/19/90 21:14:46 Message Number 4753 > Aren't you going to be suprised when you go to hell with him who you > serve. !!! Rather harsh this morning, aren't we? =========== From: RAVEN To: SAURON Subject: What I'm doing. Date & Time: 05/19/90 21:18:19 Message Number 4754 Actually Chip does not evangalize (sp?). I have known him for about three years, and not once has he attempted to convert me. Generally he only preaches at other fanatics, and then usually to try to calm them down. I wish the rest of the 'born-again christian' set were as open minded and accepting as he is; it would definately make them more tolerable. -R- =========== From: RAVEN To: DELPHI Subject: godtalk Date & Time: 05/19/90 21:24:41 Message Number 4755 Thank the gods, one of the missing viewpoints is now represented. =========== From: RAVEN To: C.C.A. Subject: Waaaay far out Date & Time: 05/19/90 21:31:44 Message Number 4756 same beliefs could have such amazingly incompatible worldviews...but I finally understood why that is. They are both churches of Satan. It says so right here in this Chick tract.) Next week: The Pope: Antichrist or jelly donut? =========== From: RAVEN To: TURTLE Subject: Real ice cream Date & Time: 05/19/90 21:35:04 Message Number 4757 I'll stick with AmigaDOS and Intuition, I think. If you really have to do the windows-icons-and-mice thing, it might as well be useful--AND off-shuttable. Besides, I've always wondered what would happen if you took the trashcan icon from Intuition and dropped it into another partition's trash can...when you emptied the trash, would the world end? =========== From: RAVEN To: KEN OBER Subject: Real dips Date & Time: 05/19/90 21:37:09 Message Number 4758 Can I borrow the bungee turtle? I just ran across 25 feet of surgical tubing, and am curious about areodynamics. :> =========== From: RAVEN To: BLACK MAGIC Subject: God... Date & Time: 05/19/90 21:52:04 Message Number 4759 Good morning. I know there are some messages from about 2 weeks back that I haven't responded to, but I can no longer find the printout I made back then. Hello, and wat were they? keep smiling, and give the fifth face a hug from me. -R- =========== From: RAVEN To: RUFUS Subject: AARGH Date & Time: 05/19/90 21:57:20 Message Number 4760 spw2k - You're playing games with a small object (foodstuff). Keep it up. :> =========== From: SPELLWIND To: Y'ALL Subject: - Date & Time: 05/19/90 22:14:02 Message Number 4761 Dyin' ain't much of a livin' boy. =========== From: CHIP P. UNICORN To: SPELLWIND Subject: Ugh.. Date & Time: 05/19/90 22:40:15 Message Number 4762 Unfortunately, I was being serious... =========== From: CHIP P. UNICORN To: JONBOY Subject: Real dips Date & Time: 05/19/90 22:41:44 Message Number 4763 >I dunno how eternal flames are as far as being conductive to >conversation... Purely from a scientists' viewpoint, I'd love to discover exactly what's being burned Down There... not only does it break all the laws of Thermodynamics, but it would make a fantasic basis for a perpetual motion machine. Irreverently yours. =========== From: CHIP P. UNICORN To: JONBOY Subject: Real dips Date & Time: 05/19/90 22:45:10 Message Number 4764 Just out of curiosity, what were your sources about the highest levels of Free Masonry? I'm interested in all sorts of secret societies. Chip P. Unicorn =========== From: CHIP P. UNICORN To: BLACK MAGIC Subject: God... Date & Time: 05/19/90 22:46:19 Message Number 4765 :>' - Rev. J. R. "Bob" Dobbs :o - "Oh, no Mr. Bill!" ':> - Frenchman with beret %< - Out cold :! - Person with cigar Chip P. Unicorn =========== From: CHIP P. UNICORN To: RUFUS Subject: Real dips Date & Time: 05/19/90 22:51:15 Message Number 4766 >Ever since I've thought up fun ways to deal with these people, they >haven't come around. Actually, nowadays, each and every true Jehovah's Witness has a Pagan Deteco-rama (tm). When a J.W. walks by a house, not only will it say to exactly which level of Hades that person is destined, but also gives annual income, the Eisenstein Gullibility Factor (tm), and whether or not they own a rifle. Chip P. Unicorn =========== From: CHIP P. UNICORN To: SPELLWIND Subject: Past Lives Date & Time: 05/19/90 22:59:06 Message Number 4768 >...in most of my previous life I was a female. This implies not all of your previous life? Hmm... >I think I'm starting to regress. It's hapening again? I know many medical doctors who would be fascinated to study you. Chip P. Unicorn =========== From: CHIP P. UNICORN To: RAVEN Subject: Real dips Date & Time: 05/19/90 23:00:50 Message Number 4769 Dear Raven, Uhhhhh... I don't agree with the philosophy that a works religion would save a person. What, precisely, would God's standard be? What if someone is "just on the line"? What if one comes to the One True Faith (tm) -- whatever that might be -- on his or her deathbed, when there's no time to do the "right works"? Also, what could we do for God, personally? If She/He/It/They are outside this world, we can't reach God ourselves. It seems more likely to me that if there's a "One True Belief," it's dependent on something other than works. Chip P. Unicorn =========== From: RUFUS To: TURTLE Subject: Messages Date & Time: 05/19/90 23:47:09 Message Number 4770 >Yes, I know. Blah blah blah. so everything's all better now... Well, thanks for clearing that up. I should sleep better tonight. =========== From: RUFUS To: RAVEN Subject: Real dips Date & Time: 05/19/90 23:49:14 Message Number 4771 25 feet of surgical tubing. You could make a really large Water Weenie (tm). =========== From: RUFUS To: SPELLWIND Subject: - Date & Time: 05/19/90 23:51:29 Message Number 4772 One O.K. quote deserves another. Happiness is a warm Uzi. -C. Brown. =========== From: RUFUS To: CHIP P. UNICORN Subject: Real dips Date & Time: 05/19/90 23:53:07 Message Number 4773 >and whether or not they own a rifle. Aha! That must be it. That explains it all. Or could it be the SAJW missle. Yes, it's the newest in missle technology. It will actually seek out copies of the Watchtower and lock-on to them. The Surface-to-Jehovah's-Witness, only from Infinity Systems, Inc. =========== From: DONTHEN To: CHIP P. UNICORN Subject: Jim Henson Date & Time: 05/20/90 02:00:25 Message Number 4774 Sammy Davis, Jr., I won't miss all that much, and Lithuania will end up getting by. Jim Henson, I'll miss. Anybody who can take a sock puppet and make a successful career out of it--entertaining people and having a hell of a lot of fun along the way--is as close to a role model for me as I'll ever get. =========== From: CORWYN OF AMBER To: TURTLE Subject: IBMs Date & Time: 05/20/90 02:37:51 Message Number 4775 I refuse to admit any responsibility for, or accept any similarity of my opinions and IBM's advertising schemes and my attitudes. I think there are some good ideas in the Macintosh, I simply despise the "proprietary" mentality, and think that Apple is taking the credit for Xerox's innovations. - Corwyn =========== From: CORWYN OF AMBER To: JONBOY Subject: windows Date & Time: 05/20/90 02:47:42 Message Number 4776 Yeah, I've used Windows... as a matter of a fact, I printed out a document from Pagemaker to a Epson RX-80 on an 8mhz XT.. Microsoft /really/ has to work on thier print routines. I've heard however, if you use PrintCache (formerly LaserTorq) that you can actually reach reason- able print speeds. (It also lets you print most full page graphics on a 512K Laserjet) By the way.. if you have a laser printer, Disable the print spooler /now/ 98% of the time, the print job takes MUCH longer when it is enabled. I want to see Windows 3.0 and Pagemaker 4.0, hopefully this will solve a /lot/ of the current problems. - Corwyn =========== From: CORWYN OF AMBER To: JONBOY Subject: Real dips Date & Time: 05/20/90 02:53:24 Message Number 4777 1. While not incredibly arrogant.. I don't think you know enough about my mind to tell me whether "better minds than [mine]" have pondered this problem. 2. I have a fairly high level of tolerance for other's beliefs, and I enjoy intelligent conversations, I simply get fed up with people who continue to claim that they are absolutely and obviously correct, I did not do so, I simply expressed exasperation with a continuance of unsubstantiated claims. Inquisition? I hardly think so, I'm just requesting that if someone is going to spout his beleifs, that he at /least/ attempt to substantiate them in some way. - Corwyn =========== From: SPELLWIND To: CHIP P. UNICORN Subject: Ugh.. Date & Time: 05/20/90 07:30:24 Message Number 4778 Who can tell with you, dude? Party on. =========== From: SPELLWIND To: CHIP P. UNICORN Subject: Masons Date & Time: 05/20/90 07:31:26 Message Number 4779 My father was a mason. 32nd or 33rd level, unfortunalely he was an alcoholic with diabetes, disability, and a heart condition and now he's dead. =========== From: SPELLWIND To: CHIP P. UNICORN Subject: God... Date & Time: 05/20/90 07:35:33 Message Number 4780 /|:| Serviceman =========== From: SPELLWIND To: CHIP P. UNICORN Subject: Real dips Date & Time: 05/20/90 07:37:56 Message Number 4781 She didn't detect me! =========== From: SPELLWIND To: CHIP P. UNICORN Subject: Past Lives Date & Time: 05/20/90 07:38:48 Message Number 4782 I said in my most previous life. =========== From: SPELLWIND To: RUFUS Subject: - Date & Time: 05/20/90 07:40:27 Message Number 4783 Go ahead, make my day. Another one from Clint. =========== From: SPELLWIND To: DONTHEN Subject: Bill & Ted Date & Time: 05/20/90 07:42:47 Message Number 4784 My role models are: Bill & Ted, Jason, Clint, Tom Savini (FX Master Extrordinaire), Richard Nixon (best ever president), Metallica (Responsible for my enviornmental concern), Michaelangelo and Raphael, William Shatner, Bill Richardson (Calvin & Hobbes artist), and any woman making over 150 g's. Oh, Turtle and Donthen are my role models too, but they're basically the same as Bill & Ted. A tolally dizzy Spellwind Dude. =========== From: DONTHEN To: CORWYN OF AMBER Subject: windows Date & Time: 05/20/90 14:52:48 Message Number 4785 I don't hold out much hope for Windows 3.0 simply because I've given up hoping anybody at Microsoft knows how to program. If the IBM version of PageMaker 4 fixes any of the "problems" with PM3 (I've never used it, but I've been told that it very much wants to be running with PostScript like the Mac PM requires), it'll be in spite of its operating environment. =========== From: TURTLE To: SPELLWIND Subject: Winger Date & Time: 05/20/90 15:55:41 Message Number 4786 >The words Winger and Metal Don't Fit. That's precisely my point. =========== From: TURTLE To: RAVEN Subject: Real ice cream Date & Time: 05/20/90 16:01:06 Message Number 4787 >AAAAAARGH! You're being wierd. Actually, I'm being weird, but that's OK. Weirdness is just another small step on the road to Slack. And what could be weirder than following a pipe-smoking middle aged salesman? The road to Slack is paved with weirdness, and your trip can be financed with easy payments. =========== From: TURTLE To: CHIP P. UNICORN Subject: Real dips Date & Time: 05/20/90 16:08:10 Message Number 4788 >I don't agree with the philosophy that works save a person. That, my friend, is a fundamental problem with Christianity. While it claims to have a code of morality associated with it,. Christianity doesn't really hold its adherents to any standard of behavior in particular--after all, the only thing which "saves" one is faith in Jesus, and everything else is irrelevant. From a Christian viewpoint it is very easy to see someone like Adolf Hitler making it into Heaven by virtue of a last-minute conversion (assuming he were sufficiently sincere, of course), while a pagan who spends his entire life working selflessly for the good of other people is condemned to Hell for his sins. I don't buy it. It also doesn't help that the Judeo-Christian value system isn't terribly sophisticated to begin with--at least not sophisticated enough to meet the demands of an industrial and technological civilization. There is nothing "immoral" to a Christian in raping the earth, dumping filth into the air, piling garbage wherever is most convenient. To a Wiccan, who follows a much more highly developed sense of standards, all these activities are gravely immoral. =========== From: TURTLE To: RUFUS Subject: SAJW & You Date & Time: 05/20/90 16:15:34 Message Number 4789 Hey, Rufus, if you'd like I can get you a subscription to the Watchtower... If you ask /really/ nicely, I may even get you both the Watchtower and the Plain Truth. (You wouldn't think that two fundamentalist orgranizations which claim to subscribe to the same beliefs could have such amazingly incompatible worldviews...but I finally understood why that is. They are both churches of Satan. It says so right here in this Chick tract.) Next week: The Pope: Antichrist or jelly donut? =========== From: TURTLE To: CORWYN OF AMBER Subject: IBMs Date & Time: 05/20/90 16:19:12 Message Number 4790 I'll stick with AmigaDOS and Intuition, I think. If you really have to do the windows-icons-and-mice thing, it might as well be useful--AND off-shuttable. Besides, I've always wondered what would happen if you took the trashcan icon from Intuition and dropped it into another partition's trash can...when you emptied the trash, would the world end? =========== From: TURTLE To: SPELLWIND Subject: Bill & Ted Date & Time: 05/20/90 16:22:41 Message Number 4791 > Oh, Turtle and Donthen are my role models too, but they're basically >the same as Bill & Ted. > > A tolally dizzy Spellwind Dude. Dude! =========== From: ANGEL To: TURTLE Subject: dirt, she says? Date & Time: 05/20/90 16:26:41 Message Number 4792 Yes, dear hacker Turtle (and damn proud of it!) You and I and most everyone else in this BBS community knows the difference between a hacker and a punk theif. Alas, the rest of the world does not. =========== From: ANGEL To: RUFUS Subject: New crusade Date & Time: 05/20/90 17:05:06 Message Number 4793 Amazing the number of folk who saw that silly promo on Channel 40. Seems I had a large audience watching me throw my skirts over my head. =========== From: ANGEL To: RUFUS Subject: What I'm doing. Date & Time: 05/20/90 17:06:58 Message Number 4794 Gee, I didn't realize a trip to a Donut shop in Orlando was necessary for charactercide. I'll have to remember that (do they have angelcreme filled donuts there? That's my favorite.) =========== From: SPELLWIND To: TURTLE Subject: Real dips Date & Time: 05/20/90 17:48:05 Message Number 4795 Hell yeah it's immoral.Not only am I looking out for my kids, I don't want to wear an ozygen mask myself. I only have one problem with recyc- ling, I have a ton of cans and paper with nowhere to take them. It may not look like it'll hurt bad in this lifetime,but if you don't do something, it gets worse! I saw a advertisement on TV yesterday for 'waste management' which means more landfills and burning. Everything going on in this world directly affects you. =========== From: SPELLWIND To: TURTLE Subject: SAJW & You Date & Time: 05/20/90 17:53:47 Message Number 4796 Give him the plain truth on europe. They're preaching now that the united europe will be the last empire of satan. =========== From: SPELLWIND To: TURTLE Subject: SAJW & You Date & Time: 05/20/90 17:55:23 Message Number 4797 You notice the other 'empires' were all of another religion, don't you? Babylon, Greece, Rome... Christianity is one of the few religions that claims to be the one truth and not even accept beleif of other religions. The only religion(s) I disbeleive are all Judeo/Christian myths. =========== From: SPELLWIND To: TOITLE Subject: Party Date & Time: 05/20/90 18:01:48 Message Number 4798 The Alter Reality gang needs to have a party soon. =========== From: JONBOY To: CORWYN OF AMBER Subject: IBMs Date & Time: 05/20/90 18:24:32 Message Number 4799 Yah my laptop boots fairly fast (still a pokey thing) I'm referring to AFTER it's done the systems checks and the RAM chsck and it just sits there like a lump. =========== From: JONBOY To: TURTLE Subject: Deal Date & Time: 05/20/90 18:29:14 Message Number 4800 Beats the shit outta me - I gave ya all the names I had and these are *bare* boards. The RAM card shouldn't be too tuff.... ===========